Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

[Sindri]

No!

Awh, it wasnt that bad was it?

The argument itself? No, not at all. But the endless repetition of the same points, the long intervals without new content... I'm not blaming anybody, especially not the people who joined after the discussion began and didn't see what came before (because going through all the old threads is really not a practicable option for anybody), but it's time to let the Legate sit in silence for a while.

If somepony has something new to say about the Legate, please do so. But everything so far has been hashed and rehashed to the point where everyone who will be convinced has been, everyone understands everyone else's positions and reasonings even if they don't agree with them, and bringing him up again without new content will lead to nothing good.

[Overthepacific]

If somepony has something new to say about the Legate, please do so. But everything so far has been hashed and rehashed to the point where everyone who will be convinced has been, everyone understands everyone else's positions and reasonings even if they don't agree with them, and bringing him up again without new content will lead to nothing good.

Save starting an argument about what color his glyphs should've glowed, I dont think it will really get anywhere either, besides, I liked red.

We are probably going to be discussing it quite diligently when the revision about it comes out anyway.

[O. Hinds]

If somepony has something new to say about the Legate, please do so. But everything so far has been hashed and rehashed to the point where everyone who will be convinced has been, everyone understands everyone else's positions and reasonings even if they don't agree with them, and bringing him up again without new content will lead to nothing good.

Save starting an argument about what color his glyphs should've glowed, I dont think it will really get anywhere either, besides, I liked red.

We are probably going to be discussing it quite diligently when the revision about it comes out anyway.

Well, the revised chapter is currently several pages longer than the old one, so you'll have plenty to discuss, I expect.

[Caoimhe]

Damn, you guys are good.

[Icy Shake]

Will the updated portions be posted in the forum, or just their locations?

[Overthepacific]

Well, the revised chapter is currently several pages longer than the old one, so you'll have plenty to discuss, I expect.

Oh, good. And I thought things were going to get boring around here.

[Downloaded Skill]

Well, about the legate, there are things I have been pondering. In PH have there been any zebras actively using offensive / elemental magic? I know that they use fetishes for illusions and transformations, but I don't think we've seen any elementalists.

Would the legate be a bit better received if, during Blackjack's fights with the zebras, there were shamans invoking elemental powers through fetishes, runes, or incantations? That way we could say the Legate's spear or runes were a focus where he can draw his powers from.

[Sindri]

Well, about the legate, there are things I have been pondering. In PH have there been any zebras actively using offensive / elemental magic? I know that they use fetishes for illusions and transformations, but I don't think we've seen any elementalists.

Would the legate be a bit better received if, during Blackjack's fights with the zebras, there were shamans invoking elemental powers through fetishes, runes, or incantations? That way we could say the Legate's spear or runes were a focus where he can draw his powers from.

I think a shaman like that would be almost by definition too rare and too valuable to be out on the edge of things. They aren't like ponies with a third of the population being natural spellcasters, instead they have a few who manufacture talismans and fetishes and potions for everyone else to use, so you'd only see non-potable magic from their specialists instead of their soldiers or scouts. Blackjack's never seen a zebra community, and the Legate is the first leader-type she's met.

That said, when the magi get together to do ritual magic? They called a freaking star to the earth and annihilated every living thing in their valley.

[Overthepacific]

Would the legate be a bit better received if, during Blackjack's fights with the zebras, there were shamans invoking elemental powers through fetishes, runes, or incantations? That way we could say the Legate's spear or runes were a focus where he can draw his powers from.

It might be a bit better received, but overall it really wouldnt have changed much.

[Guest]

@Society
The main reason these guys need to be dealt with, IMO, is the fact that Roseluck Agrifarms (makers of Roseluck Pest Solutions) is part of the Society. A key component of the serious endgame EoS enervation craziness is almost definitely going to be found there. Sure, you could reveal it some other way - random memory orb uncovered somewhere - but that would seem kinda anticlimactic and negate all that delicious foreshadowing.

[Downloaded Skill]

Well if they are just manufactured by the magically gifted and given to other zebras to use couldn't any zebra, theoretically, play the role of offensive caster / support specialist by carrying around a bunch of fetishes and invoking their power? They don't need to have the producer on the front lines, but any zebra can invoke the power. I don't think they are single use either, but I may be wrong.

I'm really just trying to theorize things that might have made the Legate work as is.

[Overthepacific]

I think a shaman like that would be almost by definition too rare and too valuable to be out on the edge of things. They aren't like ponies with a third of the population being natural spellcasters, instead they have a few who manufacture talismans and fetishes and potions for everyone else to use, so you'd only see non-potable magic from their specialists instead of their soldiers or scouts. Blackjack's never seen a zebra community, and the Legate is the first leader-type she's met.

That said, when the magi get together to do ritual magic? They called a freaking star to the earth and annihilated every living thing in their valley.

On the topic of zebra powers, did the original FoE do anything to explain into that with its zebra characters besides simple potions or powders? Or is this a completely PH creation?

[Overthepacific]

Well if they are just manufactured by the magically gifted and given to other zebras to use couldn't any zebra, theoretically, play the role of offensive caster / support specialist by carrying around a bunch of fetishes and invoking their power? They don't need to have the producer on the front lines, but any zebra can invoke the power. I don't think they are single use either, but I may be wrong.

I'm really just trying to theorize things that might have made the Legate work as is.

Theoretically, yeah, that seems about right. But I'm thinking that actually making/using them is going to take a lot of talent and skill that most zebras just arent going to have, making them a lot rarer than the typical unicorn, who can create magic with a simple thought.

[Downloaded Skill]

I figured that could just be countered by having a centralized production where most of the magically gifted would produce talismans and each tribe would have their own medicine men of sorts. The talismans don't seem hard to make from a material stand point, you just need a logically connected item. I think zenith made a flight fetish out of a ripped off pair of bug wings and magic.

[Overthepacific]

I figured that could just be countered by having a centralized production where most of the magically gifted would produce talismans and each tribe would have their own medicine men of sorts. The talismans don't seem hard to make from a material stand point, you just need a logically connected item. I think zenith made a flight fetish out of a ripped off pair of bug wings and magic.

Hmmm, possibly. I think it comes down to the lower level zebras actually being able to use them in the first place. A really complicated talisman with intricate effects might be like trying to use a piece of machinery you know nothing about. Youre going to have to be trained to use it beforehand before it works without completely backfiring on you. Instead of the straightforward effects of the one like you mentioned.

But this is all speculation into what it is and why it isnt as common as it is, so your guess is as good as mine.

[Derpmind]

It's Zebra, we don't have to explain anything. (Because it's never been explained anywhere by anyone.)

[Downloaded Skill]

But thats the perfect opportunity to explain it! If no one else cares enough, be the first!

Besides we spent like 8 pages talking about what train gauge ponies use or whether the balefire bombs were cruise missiles or ICBMs. I think magic fetishes are much more interesting for everyone involved and be commented on without having esoteric knowledge.

[Overthepacific]

It's Zebra, we don't have to explain anything. (Because it's never been explained anywhere by anyone.)

Now what fun is that?
If it doesnt currently have an explanation, then we speculate and debate about it until it does!
Or we make up our own explanation. If we didnt try to explain things with reasonable estimation until we reached a conclusion, where would we be right now?

Not here, that's for sure.

[SilentCarto]

He tried to save his family because that was all he cared about... although, arguably, he didn't care much about them, too. After determining he knew no way to safely revive them he just shrugged and went about his life for hundreds of years, perfectly happy without them, until he needed to leave in a hurry.

That's not accurate. He was okay with leaving them in stasis where they were safe until the world recovered, but when he learned that stasis didn't turn off the brain, that lit a fire under him. That was why he started making deals with (presumably) Cognitum, releasing monsters from stasis, sending henchmen to bust open stables, etc.

excuse me, I had to fight off a ridiculous crack theory in mid-sentence. Boo as the Maiden of the Stars.

Yeah, Featherdust floated that one a little while back, but I'm having trouble classifying it as 'ridiculous' or 'crack theory'. Boo is indeed a maiden, has sensory abilities and threat discrimination superior to a pipbuck, and now apparently has a defensive jinx. And coincidence and happenstance, I hasten to add, are exactly how the Stars answered BJ's prayer at Star Point. (Son of a bitch, I only just now got that! Star Point is where she talked to the Stars for the first time.) Point being, if someone here is the avatar of the stars, it's Boo.

You know, we never actually saw Boo get affected by the Enervation under Hippocratic.

Rampage and P-21 were failing fast, too. They were firing wildly now, just trying to get lucky. P-21 was bleeding out his nose. I couldn’t even see Boo.

And later, after their escape:

I made sure Boo had a snack cake and stroked her mane; she’d shaken for nearly an hour after we got free. Oddly, I think that was the natural reaction for anypony that went into the tunnels.

So even BJ doesn't necessarily chalk up the reaction to anything beyond extreme stress. I'll have to search around a little to see if Boo has ever shown the signs of Enervation, but wouldn't it be interesting if she didn't?...

[O. Hinds]

Will the updated portions be posted in the forum, or just their locations?

Sadly, I'm not sure that either will be practical, due to the nature of the edits. There are several small ones here and there in addition to the secondary (Scotch's now-removed tank ride) and, of course, the big one: the highly-altered Vitiosus scene. You can probably get by with just a: knowing that Scotch rides on Lacunae instead of in Deus now and b: reading the new Vitiosus scene, but for the full experience you might need to reread the chapter. Sorry.

On the plus side, not only is it longer, but I think that the new Vitiosus scene is much superior to the old (which I didn't really have a problem with anyway).

Besides we spent like 8 pages talking about what train gauge ponies use or whether the balefire bombs were cruise missiles or ICBMs. I think magic fetishes are much more interesting for everyone involved

But... but... Trains! Missiles! How are magic fetishes more interesting? :)

[Cptadder]

Besides we spent like 8 pages talking about what train gauge ponies use or whether the balefire bombs were cruise missiles or ICBMs. I think magic fetishes are much more interesting for everyone involved

But... but... Trains! Missiles! How are magic fetishes more interesting? :)

There there big guy, if you want we can spend a few pages talking about how Zebra's used solid or liquid fueled rocket designs and the train car layout of keeping a fuel based ICBM at the ready.
How's that sound, think a few pages of discussing literal Zebra rocket science will make you feel better?

[Moodyman90]

I was trying to catch up but then I saw "Let the Legate sit in silence for a while" and I couldn't help but picture him sitting in a corner being quiet. So any and all comments I could or did have was kinda pushed from my mind.

[Downloaded Skill]

Well Hinds I guess more interesting weren't the words I meant to use. "Something anyone can speculate on" would fit better. I know nothing about trains or missiles so looking at pages of speculation on those topics caused my eyes to glaze over. Speculating on how magic fetishes would work doesn't require engineering knowledge or reading things on Wikipedia.

[SilentCarto]

So guys, I think I've got a good posibility on what Lacunae's betrayal is.

Spoiler:

Derpmind's Prediction:

Pushing a button. Twenty-seven to sixty-seven.

Silly Blackjack, you only killed forty foals with the push of a button, not forty one!

Fencepost error! You're right -- if the people she killed were to wear numbers, this counting says that #27 would be the first foal. In that case, #28 is the second, #29 is third, and so on. Each foal is wearing #26 plus their position "in line". Ergo, the fortieth foal would be #66.

In the Fluttershy Medical Center, Blackjack killed forty foals.
She killed 40 foals.
That's as much as four tens.
And that's terrible.

[Derpmind]

Derpmind's Prediction:

Spoiler:

[SilentCarto]

Point being, if someone here is the avatar of the stars, it's Boo.

Edit: Ooh, or maybe neither one is the Maiden yet because they each have only a portion of the Star Power that the Maiden will need in order to fight the EoS. Only when Boo's soul is combined with Blackjack's will they...

Will they...

Okay, someone needs to draw BJ and Boo as the main characters of Utena now. Please? Like this:

Oh god, anime! Keep it away!:

[O. Hinds]

Besides we spent like 8 pages talking about what train gauge ponies use or whether the balefire bombs were cruise missiles or ICBMs. I think magic fetishes are much more interesting for everyone involved

But... but... Trains! Missiles! How are magic fetishes more interesting? :)

There there big guy, if you want we can spend a few pages talking about how Zebra's used solid or liquid fueled rocket designs and the train car layout of keeping a fuel based ICBM at the ready.
How's that sound, think a few pages of discussing literal Zebra rocket science will make you feel better?

Well, the Pax Roamana didn't use ICBMs, of course, but the rail-based portions of the SACII system... [rambles on for several pages].

On a more serious note, the SACII booster rockets are solid fuel. :)

[Cptadder]

Well, the Pax Roamana didn't use ICBMs, of course, but the rail-based portions of the SACII system... [rambles on for several pages].

On a more serious note, the SACII booster rockets are solid fuel. :)

See you feel better already

[Valikdu]

In the Fluttershy Medical Center, Blackjack killed forty foals.
She killed 40 foals.
That's as much as four tens.
And that's terrible.

You monster.
And me monster too, apparently, because I just laughed hard.

[Train Dodger]

Fencepost error! You're right -- if the people she killed were to wear numbers, this counting says that #27 would be the first foal. In that case, #28 is the second, #29 is third, and so on. Each foal is wearing #26 plus their position "in line". Ergo, the fortieth foal would be #66.

This is all a matter of syntax.

If you interpret it as "the total went from 27 to 67", then she's correct.

If, on the other hand, you read it as "27 through 67", then she's wrong.

Very, very simple.

[Sponsored content]