Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

[Sindri]

And could we please stop putting everything regarding chapter 54 in spoiler tags? Everpony who visits this thread should have read the chapter by now (I stopped reading this thread the moment the new chapter was announced).

Yeah, I think so. For the first few hours it's a good idea because people usually find out about the new chapter from this forum, but if it's past the twelve hour mark everybody has either read the chapter, started avoiding the forum, or wasn't checking back very often anyway. Full chapter reviews still go in spoiler boxes, but that's more for size than secrecy; nobody wants to scroll past one of my walls of text more than once.

[Harmony Ltd.]

EDIT: LOL troll groundskeeping trucks immediately start idling outside my window, screwing around with sand stashes underneath my room the second I finally decide to get some sleep. HA. HA. WHY DON'T I HAVE ANY IBUPROFEN?!

Your troubles amuse me greatly. Go on.

Regarding spoilers : I must add that on my phone (which I use half the time to browse this site), I cannot reveal spoilers : I have to use the quote function in order to read spoilered content. That's pretty tedious, which is why I tend to limit spoilers to a minimum myself.

[Sindri]

EDIT: LOL troll groundskeeping trucks immediately start idling outside my window, screwing around with sand stashes underneath my room the second I finally decide to get some sleep. HA. HA. WHY DON'T I HAVE ANY IBUPROFEN?!

Ouch. Good luck? This is one of the reasons I've invested in some really good earplugs. And welding goggles, for when a migraine gets too bad for normal sunglasses.

[Guest]

Every twenty-some minutes, the sand trucks cometh. And it takes me about half an hour to go to sleep. Oh Mister Sandman, GET THE FUCK AWAY FROM MY FUCKING ROOM. On the bright side, my headache is mostly gone! On the downside, today is going to be a loooooong day, and I'd rather face it with sleep.

Anyway, thanks for the sympathies, Harmony and Sindri (well, Harmony's was implied =P). I wish I could do earplugs, but I need to be able to hear my alarm clock, sadly. If it was a weekend, I could just put on some WITTR and go to sleep with that in the background, but it is not. At least I don't think I get migraines - most of the people I know who get those seem to be completely incapacitated by them, and my headaches mostly go away if I'm given a dark room to rest in for an hour or two (singing at the top of my lungs while doing so has also been known to help). They also respond to normal, non-prescription painkillers. So, yeah: Sindri, you've got my sympathies on having troubles with migraines - I can only imagine how bad they must get to require welding goggles, yikes.

EDIT: Oh, and Wavey, that's a nice picture, well drawn!

[Luminous Lead]

Plausible. Larger scale than anything ever built before in the Hoof though; just getting the tokomare running in the first place was a monumental undertaking. Unless... what was the time scale on Project Horizons? Because the Core has been putting out constant power, and there are tunnels all over the Hoof with little or no interference, and those industrial sprite bot construction things (can't remember the name right now) could keep building without live input as long as they had a good computer and a steady power supply... that count-up that was approaching ten million, was there anything there indicating it wasn't feedback from an almost-complete network of shield generators?

Well we've never really been told what the enervation fields are REALLY for and enervation rings have been scattered all over the hoof, so a giant single-frequency shield generator isn't too far out there. Blackjack's prophetic vision of emperor P-21 DID involve all of Hoofington trapped under a giant shield.

As for Legate, I'm surprised no one's suggested that he's a cyber. Would certainly be a fitting counterpart to Blackjack. Then again, since he has runes engraved on his freaking TEETH, it's possible that the guy is pretty much an organic talisman. Or maybe he's just a psion. *mutter*... freaky zebras and their psychic powers... *mutter*

[Kippershy]

I don't know if I said it here, but I definitely have called the odds on him being at least partially cybernetic as being pretty high somewhere.
Though I'm trying not to speak about him or that fight at all.

[Harmony Ltd.]

Anyway, thanks for the sympathies, Harmony and Sindri (well, Harmony's was implied =P).

[Mister Nikel]

After reading chapter 54

Well. Shit. The legate is Miraak on Very Hard Mode+Deadly Dragons. BJ and CO are so fucking fucked. Good thing he is is so prideful. I mean holy shit there are not enough swear words in the world to describe this. I thought Lanius was a nasty piece of work back in NV but this guy. Just. Fuck. Who the fucking fuckity fuck fuck fuck catches 120mm tank rounds with his fucking bare fucking hooves?! And then get his head cut off and then reverse the damage.
SHIT

As for the chapter as a whole. Great as usual. Deus was nerfed hard though. Still hd his moments though. P21 leveled up in badass after he kicked his addiction. The part where he shot a bloodhound in the mouth was epic.

The flashback was done great. Have no complaints there. And I approve of the new BJ who does sensible things instead of screaming 100% PARAGON OR DEATH from the top of her lungs. Even Pip had the decency to shoot Autumn Leaf in the face. Nothing wrong with killing monsters.

But bloody hell. The Zebras really stole the show. this chapter was great. Thank you Somber. Thank you editor team.

[CamoBadger]

I'm just going with him being Alex Mercer. That way if he does anything more ridiculous I won't be surprised at all. As far as I'm concerned, he's only served as the Big Bad for the story now, and I like him a hell of a lot more than Sanguine.
I think the only thing I would have liked is if he'd killed one of the group. Mainly because they still seem to have A-Team level plot armour and if he was the first to kill one of them it would drive home the point that he is not to be fucked with (you know, just in case being THE badass wasn't enough for BJ).

[Retl]

Re-listened to the chapter a few more times and actually glanced over the text this time.

I took Lacunae's accepting responsibility for the shot the wrong way. It seems like she's saying that she pulled the trigger for Blackjack. I actually have a hard time believing that, even with the narration skipping a step to imply otherwise. It's not so much a disbelief that Lacunae would, resistance to letting Blackjack not own that responsibility.

(My misinterpretation: "Then I pulled the trigger," when read through Text to Speech, I took it the same way as "Forgive me Luna, for I have taken the life of another." I thought it actually was Psalm and missed the following clarifying line about who the speaker was. It's a lot more obvious with the formatting in the Google Doc.)

I think the only thing I would have liked is if he'd killed one of the group. Mainly because they still seem to have A-Team level plot armour and if he was the first to kill one of them it would drive home the point that he is not to be fucked with (you know, just in case being THE badass wasn't enough for BJ).

The timing seemed exactly right for such a thing to happen, too, what with Hellhounds showing around. Moreso if it had been a death that Blackjack had been able to prevent.
That said, I'm kinda glad noone did. I'm pretty fond of the group we have now. Cool chapter either way, in my book.

[Kippershy]

I'm just going with him being Alex Mercer. That way if he does anything more ridiculous I won't be surprised at all. As far as I'm concerned, he's only served as the Big Bad for the story now, and I like him a hell of a lot more than Sanguine.
I think the only thing I would have liked is if he'd killed one of the group. Mainly because they still seem to have A-Team level plot armour and if he was the first to kill one of them it would drive home the point that he is not to be fucked with (you know, just in case being THE badass wasn't enough for BJ).

If he had simply walked on up to Deus and destroyed him, I would've been happy - now you mention it.
That would have been a nice death.
I would say Rampage, but if he had managed to kill her once and for all I wouldn't know if I'd hate him more for being that ultra god mode or if I should respect him for having some kind of ancient power that's the only thing capable of killing the eternal warrior. Would've then have made sense for him to be able to do all that.

[Luminous Lead]

I was pretty sure that Rampage was going to die this chapter, actually. She's kind of the Steelhooves of the group, and

Spoiler:

Boo is pretty much confirmed to have Per 10 and Lck 10.

As for taking the shot, I'm sure that was meant to be Psalm. For pretty much the whole story Blackjack has claimed "I'm not a judge, nor an executioner". Well, she's definitely been a judge, but so far she's kept free of coldblooded killing. Looks like we're finally seeing the effects of Lacunae's "selfishness" alluded to by the goddess earlier on. Blackjack has to be careful about how she plays judge because, from now on, she has a resident executioner who really isn't picky about her targets.

[Sindri]

As for Legate, I'm surprised no one's suggested that he's a cyber. Would certainly be a fitting counterpart to Blackjack. Then again, since he has runes engraved on his freaking TEETH, it's possible that the guy is pretty much an organic talisman. Or maybe he's just a psion. *mutter*... freaky zebras and their psychic powers... *mutter*

Cybernetics and zebra alchemic upgrades don't mix for some reason, at least according to Littlepip's perk descriptions, but I wouldn't expect the Legate to be necessarily bound by that rule so I'll put it in the maybe pile. Personally I think it likely that all his organic parts have been upgraded, but none replaced.

Given that dragons eat gems, and gems are made into high-end talismans, I'm thinking that dragonbone can probably be used by those with the right knowledge as a sort of refined gemstone for more powerful items. And that's on top of whatever personal enchantments he has, and somewhere between two hundred and several thousand years of hardcore combat experience.

[hawkeye92]

Just read the latest chapter. It was pretty good.
The exchange at the beginning was... Odd. got a laugh out of Glory being attracted to P-21 though, amongst other things.
I always thought the ponies' reproduction would be cyclical but not tied to seasons, like people. Purely based on research on various animal species when breeding for domestication their reproductive habits shift that way due to better shelter, more food etc over a very short period of time so I'd just guess ponies would be the same.
It bears no relevance to the story though and quite frankly I don't really care, but animal domestication resarch really is fascinating sometimes.
Then Psalm shoots Big Mac. I kinda guessed this would happen. It certainly explains why she went so unstable afterwards.
The battlefield conjured up some pretty awesome Grimdark imagery. I wonder why it smells of sulphur though after 200 years, unless it's tectonically active around there (in which case building hoofington underground is a mite silly). It works as a reference to hell though.
The raiders were good for a laugh. Typical like the games with massive overconfidence, except they don't start shooting as readily. Of course, rapidly followed by the execution of Clink, one of the rapists from the Seahorse. With that, Blackjack's slow demise to the dark side is just one step closer... Or is it? I do see why Lac pulled the trigger, the only other alternative to not start to lose face would be to mangle all of his limbs, heal him JUST enough so they won't die then leave with some menacing threat.
But that's actually evil as opposed to morally dubious.
I liked the internal conflict there, especially since it happened right after telling the leader 'I don't play judge and excecutioner.' It would be simply dreddful if she did (groan).
Admittedly that is one of blackjack's best features. Yes, it means sometimes bad guys get away but if you stoop low enough often enough you're just another bad guy. In fact it was Littlepip's summary execution of Autumn that made me realise I really didn't like her any more. However in this case if blackjack has shot Clink I wouldn't have thought much less of her.
The big thing about Autumn is that he was unarmed, unable to move and 'Pip had given her word that if Autumn helped her overload his weapon (which he did), she would get him out, then she went back on her word spectacularly. Maybe it's just me who holds a lot of value to someone's word, especially when it's used with such gravity.
"apparently summary executions were quite persuasive. No wonder they were so common. If I’d just started killing people from the outset, the Hoof would probably be fixed by now."
-This phrase right here is really good. Perfectly cynical.

The zebras are back, complete with their robot legions and Lancer to boot. Why do I get a sinking feeling that everything's going to go bad?

The secret Thunderhead base was cool, the first look at mind controlled Hellhounds. As is finding out that Glory can in fact bypass shields designed for Rainbow. I can understand Sunset's reaction upon learning this given the stakes riding on it, but props to Twister for letting them go. A shame Sunset had to die though. I'm also noticing pegasi seem to be really easy to catch in melee despite having wings.
Glory looking like Dash on Dash? Haha, that's strange to see. Then we meet the big bad legate zebra. He's a bit mental. Both phsycologically and his powers seem strange, in superhero territory. I hope this gets explained later on.
Interesting speech by the legate. I wonder if when dealing with the Enclave Blackjack will go totally nuts but I somehow doubt it. Blackjack's come this far already, she probably has what it takes. He'll just be the last bad guy to deal with when Hoofington isn't a hellish nightmare any more. I wonder if he'd be able to take on Dawn 2.0?
The discussion about destiny was great afterwards. Although I do remember P-21 getting told he's already fufilled his.
Somepony with a flying machine. I can't remember anyone except for Ditzy. I'm intrigued as to where it's going next.

[chinman]

Somepony with a flying machine eh? Funny you should mention Ditzy at this particularly point, especially considering how close the timeing is to the big events of FoE Chapter 38 and my own crazy fan theory. *cough*LacunaewillbethealicornthatrescuesPipfromMaripony!*cough*

[jacky2734]

Alright everybody. It's time to play a new game. It's called "How to kill the nigh invulnerable, element wielding, rune empowered Zebra"

Would a Balefire Megaspell be considered overkill for him?

[chinman]

Alright everybody. It's time to play a new game. It's called "How to kill the nigh invulnerable, element wielding, rune empowered Zebra"

Would a Balefire Megaspell be considered overkill for him?

Guy like that, theres only one thing to do.

TO THE MOOOOOOOOOONAH!

[Sindri]

Somepony with a flying machine eh? Funny you should mention Ditzy at this particularly point, especially considering how close the timeing is to the big events of FoE Chapter 38 and my own crazy fan theory. *cough*LacunaewillbethealicornthatrescuesPipfromMaripony!*cough*

Nah, that was Twilight. Besides, how would Lacunae even get there?

Alright everybody. It's time to play a new game. It's called "How to kill the nigh invulnerable, element wielding, rune empowered Zebra"

Would a Balefire Megaspell be considered overkill for him?

Rule 37: There is no 'overkill.' There is only 'open fire' and 'I need to reload.'

I do think that a showdown between Vitiosus and Dawn would be productive for all involved though.

[CamoBadger]

Alright everybody. It's time to play a new game. It's called "How to kill the nigh invulnerable, element wielding, rune empowered Zebra"

Would a Balefire Megaspell be considered overkill for him?

BJ will kill him at the same time as the Eater of Souls and herself by activating Project Horizons.
Everyone dies, world is saved, readers get severely depressed as P21, Scotch and Glory lose their friend. Luckily by this point they'll be together because Gloryheat and somehow it will work.

Aw yiss drunk theory

[chinman]

I do think that a showdown between Vitiosus and Dawn would be productive for all involved though.

THIS. A thousand times this. This was pretty much the scenario I'm sure a lot of us were immediately hoping for the moment Somber went and introduced a second god-tier character just chapters after CyberDawn made her appearance, if not for the massively awesome battle that would ensue, then for the chance to see the Harbingers and the Remnant pick one someone besides Blackjack for a change.

So how the heck one goes about killing a nigh invulnerable, element wielding, rune empowered Zebra? The answer probably rests in BJ and crew figuring out how and where he got that power in the first place.

As for that crazy fan theory, yeah its a long shot, however its worth remembering that Lacunae can teleport just about anywhere she's already been so long as she's soaked up enough rads, and Maripony is pretty much the one place every alicorn is guaranteed to have been at least once. Add to this some of Lacunae's earlier quotes, most notably one from Hightower (at least I think Hightower, why must this story be so loooong! *pouts*) where she states her belief that there is "more of Twilight stuffed in me than anywhere else in Unity" and it might at least be possible.

[chinman]

BJ will kill him at the same time as the Eater of Souls and herself by activating Project Horizons.
Everyone dies, world is saved, readers get severely depressed as P21, Scotch and Glory lose their friend. Luckily by this point they'll be together because Gloryheat and somehow it will work.

Aw yiss drunk theory

Wow. Considering the name of the last act of the story is "Homecoming", and just what that statement implies (see chap 34) this theory does make a heck of a lot of sense.

[Retl]

Alright everybody. It's time to play a new game. It's called "How to kill the nigh invulnerable, element wielding, rune empowered Zebra"

I might be bending the rules a bit as he wouldn't be dead, but I'd be amused if Vitiosus wound up buried in a well that was blasted to pieces, trapped. Someday maybe days, years, or centuries later, he’d escape. Not sure what would happen then.

[Sindri]

Alright everybody. It's time to play a new game. It's called "How to kill the nigh invulnerable, element wielding, rune empowered Zebra"

I might be bending the rules a bit as he wouldn't be dead, but I'd be amused if Vitiosus wound up buried in a well that was blasted to pieces, trapped. Someday maybe days, years, or centuries later, he’d escape. Not sure what would happen then.

Nah. Authority over earth, sea, and sky, remember? If he was trapped but alive he'd force the dirt to dig him out. I think we need fire. Lots of it. Possibly of the 'bale' flavor.

[Moodyman90]

Or you know, do the opposite of what happened to Luna.

Send him to the Sun.

[RoboRed]

Okay...FINALLY caught up. With everything. In this thread. Well over *looks at watch* a month later. I'm too absurdly persistent for my own good.

First thing's first:

Wow, it's been roughly a year and a month since I first started reading Project Horizons and first posted in the comments section on EQD. I'd like to take this moment to thank all you guys. You've been my major and favorite niche in the brony community, and my main hangout. I'd like to thank Somber, especially. If it weren't for this magnificent story you've written, I would've never met so many great people and made the friends I have here now. You're all awesome.

[RoboRed]

Next, overall chapter comments:

ch53:

ch54:

[RoboRed]

And fuck me, I broke everything...one sec...

[Cptadder]

And back for chapter 54, it's been some time so I re-read the end of Chapter 53 and was reminded again about how much that turn annoyed me. It still in my mind lessons the Enclave while pumps up the Goddess. But with myself once again centered back into Fallout Equestria:Project Horizons time to read on.


What I liked
And we are back, looks like the gang is all here, we get an idea of where everyone is going quickly. We get a short Deus disscussion but more importantly the entire thing is while everypony is gearing up and strapping on explosives. For once in a long while they are going prepared and with a plan..... Over under ten pages before they end up seperated and Blackjack catches fire.

P-21 forgets he's not a sitcom dad for a second, and more importantly he has a stable-99 mare for a daughter. Slightly squick but a good reminder of that place.

....and then Blackjack tops that with this

Bisexuality: double your options, double your fun!

Oh Blackjack



What I noticed
I was wondering about how to get all the bombs in Deus but then it came to me the obvious explanation, wire the bombs then stick in the brain. Wonder if we will get a peak at what Deus was doing while he spent a few weeks "locked in" to his cyberbrain with nothing to do, but... then no pain either. Not being dead must have been rather annoying.


And Blackjack falls asleep on a Doof to wake up at an infamous ridge when the war will be forever changed. When things will go to hell and... I'm confused as hell about the timeline of this. The War is twenty years long, ten years under Celestia then the Littehorn incident and Luna takes over, how long into Luna's run is the Ridge?

Snide and Co are a reference to Dragon Age it seems.

I’m trying to access a super-secure facility. The password is thirteen characters long. It’s not exactly easy to figure out.” He typed some more on the terminal, scowling as if it’d given him a personal insult.

Fallout security is adorable, thirteen characters for a super secure facility, you only needed nine to launch a Nuke in Loansome Road.

What I disliked.......
Okay I'll be blunt, first time I've not spoilered this section
When I got to the section with the sequence of Celestia and Big Mac's death I flipped a fucking table.
Then I walked away, calmed down and took the dog for a walk and sat down and re-read... and flipped another table
What the hell... seriously Somber?
The story we are told in FoE, the constraints you've placed yourself on is not about the noble 96 and the 200 ponies who died to keep Celestia alive. The story in FoE is about Big Mac who is not a member the equivalent of Seal Team Six, the pony who steps forward and catches a bullet meant for the Princess. It's not clear who fires it from where in the crowd at the meeting place.

Instead we get a pitched battle and the Mauraders are working security? Where the hell is the Royal Guard? When did the described assassination attempt in FoE get turned Tehran 1979?
In FoE we have a picture of Big Mac, the ordinary soldier "catching the football" to use a Secret Service term for taking a bullet with your body meant for your principle.... now in chapter 45 it's a bloody combined arms assault.

....What?
No seriously what? What's the thinking, the rational for this? I said way back when if Pslam was the one to try and kill Celestia and kill Big Mac instead it would be bad writing. This is worse because instead of a grassy knoll Pslam shooter we have Pslam deciding to blow Celestia's brains out... CELESTIA for crisssake when the situation is still well in hand. They are both up and alive, ammunition is still good and there's still backup nearby.

And she's a sniper! If they get their hooves on Celestia you blown her brains out then? What the fuck Pslam... What the hell Somber?

And why is Blackjack not killing Lancer? The last time the two of them met was it not with some blood debts and lots of promises of future murder going on?

And the Legate is... what? The Avatar? I can buy freaky Zebra magic talismans but they seem to be one use items until now. Batman the Legate with a fetish or talism for every situation but the Avatar Legate? Not even Twilight can manage that, so what's going on here?


And the chapter is over
Final Thoughts on Chapter 54
Legate the super Zebra I can get beyond with enough explanation or enough foreshadowing. But to give him everything from lighting bending to gravity control in one go? Somber there's a method of showing domination. As an alternative if you had said "Can my friends join in? Sure Blackjack if you don't mind my soldiers joining in, one on one or 500 vs 10 your choice" that gives a reason why Blackjack has to face 1 on 1 with this Zebra. He's got the zebra pony, he sets the rules. Instead he takes on the entire gang and a tank and no-sells the entire fight. When Blackjack does come up with a trick it turns out he's also a Homunculis as he just heals from a bad stab wound to the throat in almost the same way.

You want to sell us on the threat of bad ass Legate you went overboard as unless Blackjack gets turned into a mecha or nukes him I don't buy her being able to take him under any circumstance.

But that is part a matter of taste and a matter of opinion. My real gripe is and will remain with Shattered Hoof. Pslam is the real sniper, that's an idea I hated from day one because it breaks the very core of the hidden lesson of Big Mac.

That hidden lesson is this, even something as selfless as Big Mac giving his life for Celestia can be used to justify horrible actions by other ponies. The memory of that selfless act is taken by the selfless and twisted into justifying actions that end up almost destroying the world.

But that lesson in PH is gone now, because Big Mac did not stop a zebra assassin of his own free will, of an almost thought. Instead of a brief moment, a shining moment of sacrifice it's a pitched battle and he's shot down like a dog. So the entire incident might not have even happened, who cares about Big Mac. He's just one of forty dead ponies who happen to die atop Celestia....

You know what I'm going into a separate post, post break here.

[Cptadder]

Okay I'm going back to re-read everyone's response first before I continue on my Shattered Hoof tirade, let me see what's already been covered.

[Ketchup]

It seems this chapter is a 'meh' one or a fantastic one, depending on the reader.

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