Re: Gun/Military Thread

[Ironmonger]

I'm almost tempted to set up one of those shotgun tripwires like in New Vegas. Too bad I'd get in legal trouble for that. And hospital bills.

Would be an interesting doorbell.

[Frost]

It's a shame trench coats look really conspicuous nowadays. Otherwise I could concealed carry a Mossberg or Remigton 700.

[CamoBadger]

Yeah, but there are still some places in the world where it doesn't matter what you where. I know that some towns in the mountains still see them as commonplace (visited on town up in Montana where it seemed like every other person had one on).

Of course this also carries over to other things, such as people walking around with a six shooter on their thigh (still legal where I live every day except sunday, election day, and holidays), but most people don't do it anymore.
Doesn't mean I haven't seen someone walking around with a .45 on their hip occasionally, which I think is cool as hell. And on Halloween a lot of people in my apartment complex decided that if they carried their guns around nobody would think they were real. We were right XD

[Frost]

Yeah, Open Carry is legal and permit-free here in Ohio. I just wish people didn't flip their shit all the time when they saw a gun.

[CamoBadger]

BUT GUNS R EEVILL! U CANT CARY ONE AROWND LIEK DAT!!!! U MUST B PLANNING TO KEEL SOME1!

Yeah, it's stupid. Law says you can, but every time you consider it you know that some retard is going to call the police about it.

[Frost]

Society in general seems more about calling the police and relying on lawyers for your problems instead of personal responsibility, so it's unsurprising

[CamoBadger]

They do. Why learn what the laws actually are where you live when you can just call the cops for every little thing instead?

Which is why I learned all of the gun laws for where I live, so that if some idiot does try to call the police, I'll just inform them I'm not doing anything illegal and I can continue about my day.

[Ironmonger]

I'm pretty sure here in Ohio we can get away with one of our more interesting ideas: Dressing up as WW2 officers with the appropriate weaponry. We went to this ice cream shop in Old Milford as a group, and I, noticing how much space my group took up, joked we should all be carrying Nagants slung over our backs. We looked a little like a gang hehe

[Frost]

I stay current on gun laws as well and I've realized that despite their rapidly rising ubiquity (the number of permit holders has been on a steady increase for several years) some people seem to be getting less comfortable with guns. It's annoying, really. I would carry a gun to protect myself, not murder hippies, no matter how much the hippies preach to me that I'm a murderer for carrying a gun

[IncoherentOrange]

To be fair, if nobody had guns then people couldn't kill people using them, because they wouldn't have them. (Derp.)

But... what's the fun in that? They make noise and make holes in things, and are capable defensive weapons. Perhaps fun and perhaps effective, but only in responsible (or, even, smarter than a brick) hands.

It's not illogical to assume that because you want to carry a gun you're willing to kill with it. Of course, a carrying license is supposed to be for self-defense, nothing more, but activists might ignore that part.

As for the willingness to kill someone? I don't feel like getting into the ethics of that matter, really, but I will say that if they're trying to kill you, then... don't try to kill them. Maiming is far more preferable, but, of course, not always practical... It's no small matter, using a gun on someone, as has been stated before.

[Frost]

Of you outlawed guns, then the only people who have guns would be criminals

Of course you're willing to use a gun if you carry.... In self-defense. If you lawfully carry, you, by definition, aren't looking to murder anyone. It's infantile to advocate guns because they're "cool" or "fun", though that may be part of the factor in buying one.

[Ironmonger]

An australian once said that where he lives they aren't even allowed to have guns. Bad mojo if you get robbed.

[IncoherentOrange]

Y'see, the only reason I want a gun (or, at least, ammunition) is to be able to shoot targets, because it's fun. But, that's no reason to carry one around. That is infantile. If you're carrying one around, it's for defense and/or soldiering, not looking cool or having fun. If you have one, and don't carry it, it's either a hunting weapon or a range weapon.

[Frost]

The only gun-rights group I'm not a fan of is the GOA. They're the kinds of people who advocate that the mentally ill should be allowed to own guns.

[Admiral Stoic Rum]

hahah, my job tried to tell me I couldn't keep a gun in my car, Texas state law states that employers cannot prohibit employees from keeping firearms concealed within their cars as long as the vehicle is locked,the firearm concealed and it is in a parking lot or garage. Premises in the law is defined as with in the building and its attachments... so if they had a bathroom or interior section attached to the building firearms are prohibited, however they can't fire me for having my gun concealed in my car, even if they find it in a search they cannot legally fire me with out repercussion because tey are prohibited from disallowing me to keep a firearm in my car. hahah!!!

Labor Code Subchapter GA
52.061. Restriction on Prohibiting Employee Access to or Storage of Firearm or Ammunition.
A public or private employer may not prohibit an employee who holds a license to carry a
concealed handgun under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, who otherwise lawfully possesses
a firearm, or who lawfully possesses ammunition from transporting or storing a firearm or ammunition the
employee is authorized by law to possess in a locked, privately owned motor vehicle in a parking lot, parking
garage, or other parking area the employer provides for employees.
Sec.A52.062.AAEXCEPTIONS.
(a) Section 52.061 does not:
(1) authorize a person who holds a license to carry a concealed handgun under Subchapter H,
Chapter 411, Government Code, who otherwise lawfully possesses a firearm, or who lawfully
possesses ammunition to possess a firearm or ammunition on any property where the possession
of a firearm or ammunition is prohibited by state or federal law; or
(2) apply to:
(A) a vehicle owned or leased by a public or private employer and used by an
employee in the course and scope of the employee ’s employment, unless the
employee is required to transport or store a firearm in the officia discharge
of the employee ’s duties;
(B) a school district;
(C) an open-enrollment charter school, as defined by Section 5.001, Education
Code;
(D) a private school, as defined by Section 22.081, Education Code;
(E) property owned or controlled by a person, other than the employer, that is www.handgunlaw.us 5
subject to a valid, unexpired oil, gas, or other mineral lease that
contains a provision prohibiting the possession of firearms on the
property; or
(F) property owned or leased by a chemical manufacturer or oil and gas refiner
with an air authorization under Chapter 382, Health and Safety Code, and on
which the primary business conducted is the manufacture, use, storage, or
transportation of hazardous, combustible, or explosive materials, except in
regard to an employee who holds a license to carry a concealed handgun
under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, and who stores a firearm
or ammunition the employee is authorized by law to possess in a locked,
privately owned motor vehicle in a parking lot, parking garage, or other
parking area the employer provides for employees that is outside of a
secured and restricted area:
(i)A that contains the physical plant;
(ii)A that is not open to the public; and
(iii)Athe ingress into which is constantly monitored by security personnel.
(b) Section 52.061 does not prohibit an employer from prohibiting an employee who holds a license to carry
a concealed handgun under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, or who otherwise lawfully
possesses a firearm, from possessing a firearm the employee is otherwise authorized by law to possess on the
premises of the employer ’s business. In this subsection, "premises" has the meaning assigned by Section
46.035(f)(3), Penal Code.
Sec.A411.203.AARights of Employers. This subchapter does not prevent or otherwise limit the right of a
public or private employer to prohibit persons who are licensed under this subchapter from carrying a
concealed handgun on the premises of the business. In this section, "premises" has the meaning assigned by
Section 46.035(f)(3), Penal Code.
Note: This is not the complete law on Parking Lot Storage. See Texas Statutes for complete Law.

Texas penal Code

(3) "Premises" means a building or a portion of a
building. The term does not include any public or private driveway,
street, sidewalk or walkway, parking lot, parking garage, or other
parking area.

[Frost]

What do you carry, Rum?

[Admiral Stoic Rum]

hahah, my job tried to tell me I couldn't keep a gun in my car, Texas state law states that employers cannot prohibit employees from keeping firearms concealed within their cars as long as the vehicle is locked,the firearm concealed and it is in a parking lot or garage. Premises in the law is defined as with in the building and its attachments... so if they had a bathroom or interior section attached to the building firearms are prohibited, however they can't fire me for having my gun concealed in my car, even if they find it in a search they cannot legally fire me with out repercussion because tey are prohibited from disallowing me to keep a firearm in my car. hahah!!!

Labor Code Subchapter GA
52.061. Restriction on Prohibiting Employee Access to or Storage of Firearm or Ammunition.
A public or private employer may not prohibit an employee who holds a license to carry a
concealed handgun under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, who otherwise lawfully possesses
a firearm, or who lawfully possesses ammunition from transporting or storing a firearm or ammunition the
employee is authorized by law to possess in a locked, privately owned motor vehicle in a parking lot, parking
garage, or other parking area the employer provides for employees.
Sec.A52.062.AAEXCEPTIONS.
(a) Section 52.061 does not:
(1) authorize a person who holds a license to carry a concealed handgun under Subchapter H,
Chapter 411, Government Code, who otherwise lawfully possesses a firearm, or who lawfully
possesses ammunition to possess a firearm or ammunition on any property where the possession
of a firearm or ammunition is prohibited by state or federal law; or
(2) apply to:
(A) a vehicle owned or leased by a public or private employer and used by an
employee in the course and scope of the employee ’s employment, unless the
employee is required to transport or store a firearm in the officia discharge
of the employee ’s duties;
(B) a school district;
(C) an open-enrollment charter school, as defined by Section 5.001, Education
Code;
(D) a private school, as defined by Section 22.081, Education Code;
(E) property owned or controlled by a person, other than the employer, that is www.handgunlaw.us 5
subject to a valid, unexpired oil, gas, or other mineral lease that
contains a provision prohibiting the possession of firearms on the
property; or
(F) property owned or leased by a chemical manufacturer or oil and gas refiner
with an air authorization under Chapter 382, Health and Safety Code, and on
which the primary business conducted is the manufacture, use, storage, or
transportation of hazardous, combustible, or explosive materials, except in
regard to an employee who holds a license to carry a concealed handgun
under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, and who stores a firearm
or ammunition the employee is authorized by law to possess in a locked,
privately owned motor vehicle in a parking lot, parking garage, or other
parking area the employer provides for employees that is outside of a
secured and restricted area:
(i)A that contains the physical plant;
(ii)A that is not open to the public; and
(iii)Athe ingress into which is constantly monitored by security personnel.
(b) Section 52.061 does not prohibit an employer from prohibiting an employee who holds a license to carry
a concealed handgun under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, or who otherwise lawfully
possesses a firearm, from possessing a firearm the employee is otherwise authorized by law to possess on the
premises of the employer ’s business. In this subsection, "premises" has the meaning assigned by Section
46.035(f)(3), Penal Code.
Sec.A411.203.AARights of Employers. This subchapter does not prevent or otherwise limit the right of a
public or private employer to prohibit persons who are licensed under this subchapter from carrying a
concealed handgun on the premises of the business. In this section, "premises" has the meaning assigned by
Section 46.035(f)(3), Penal Code.
Note: This is not the complete law on Parking Lot Storage. See Texas Statutes for complete Law.

Texas penal Code

(3) "Premises" means a building or a portion of a
building. The term does not include any public or private driveway,
street, sidewalk or walkway, parking lot, parking garage, or other
parking area.

those without liscense:
Title 10 . Section 1
Section 46.02
(a) A person commits an offense if the person [he] intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or
about his or her person a handgun, illegal knife, or club if the person is not:
(1) on the person's own premises or premises under the person's control; or
(2) inside of or directly en route to a motor vehicle or watercraft that is owned by the person
or under the person's control.
(a-1) A person commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about
his or her person a handgun in a motor vehicle or watercraft that is owned by the person or under the
person's control at any time in which:
(1) the handgun is in plain view; or
(2) the person is:
(A) engaged in criminal activity, other than a Class C misdemeanor that is a violation of
a law or ordinance regulating traffic or boating;
(B) prohibited by law from possessing a firearm; or
(C) a member of a criminal street gang, as defined by Section 71.01
(a-2) For purposes of this section, "premises" includes real property and a recreational vehicle that is being
used as living quarters, regardless of whether that use is temporary or permanent. In this subsection,
"recreational vehicle" means a motor vehicle primarily designed as temporary living quarters or a
vehicle that contains temporary living quarters and is designed to be towed by a motor vehicle. The
term includes a travel trailer, camping trailer, truck camper, motor home, and horse trailer with living
quarters.
(a-3) For purposes of this section, "watercraft" means any boat, motorboat, vessel, or personal watercraft,
other than a seaplane on water, used or capable of being used for transportation on water.www.handgunlaw.us 7
Section 2.
(b) Section 46.02 does not apply to a person who:
(1) is in the actual discharge of official duties as a member of the armed forces or state
military forces as defined by Section 431.001, Government Code, or as a guard
employed by a penal institution;
(2) is on the person's own premises or premises under the person's control unless the person
is an employee or agent of the owner of the premises and the person's primary
responsibility is to act in the capacity of a security guard to protect persons or property,
in which event the person must comply with Subdivision (5);
(3) is traveling;
(4) [is engaging in lawful hunting, fishing, or other sporting activity on the immediate
premises where the activity is conducted, or is en route between the premises and the
actor's residence, motor vehicle, or watercraft if the weapon is a type commonly used in
the activity;
(5) holds a security officer commission issued by the Texas [Board of Private Investigators
and] Private Security Board [Agencies], if:
(A) the person is engaged in the performance of the person's duties as a security officer
or traveling to and from the person's place of assignment;
(B) the person is wearing a distinctive uniform; and
(C) the weapon is in plain view;
(6) is carrying a concealed handgun and a valid license issued under Subchapter H, Chapter
411, Government Code [Article 4413(29ee), Revised Statutes], to carry a concealed
handgun of the same category as the handgun the person is carrying;
(7) holds a security officer commission and a personal protection officer authorization issued
by the Texas [Board of Private Investigators and] Private Security Board
[Agencies] and [who] is providing personal protection under Chapter 1702, Occupations
Code [the Private Investigators and Private Security Agencies Act (Article 4413(29bb),
Vernon's Texas Civil Statutes)]; or
(8) holds an alcoholic beverage permit or license or is an employee of a holder of an
alcoholic beverage permit or license if the person is supervising the operation of the
permitted or licensed premises.
Section 3. The following provisions are repealed:
(1) Section 46.15(h), Penal Code; and
(2) Section 46.15(i), Penal Code, as added by Chapter 288, Acts of the 79th Legislature,
Regular Session, 2005.
Section 4. The change in law made by this Act applies only to an offense committed on or
after the effective date of this Act. An offense committed before the effective date of this Act is
governed by the law in effect when the offense was committed, and the former law is continued
in effect for that purpose. For purposes of this section, an offense was committed before the
effective date of this Act if any element of the offense was committed before that date.
Section 5. This Act takes effect September 1, 2007.

[Frost]

All I know is I would hate hate hate to live in California. Their laws are downright draconian.

[Admiral Stoic Rum]

it would require a massive installment of freethinkers to turn that state around

[Ironmonger]

One thing that irritates me to no end is the law that states you can only use 5-round magazines for hunting.

Least I think that's what it says. Part of my brain feels like it aint there right now.

[Frost]

The bullshit Assault Weapons Ban is still in effect there. That should tell you all you need to know.

[Frost]

So I was browsing through a new gun shop that's just opened up near me (Point Blank) and I saw this. It was $308, and I vaguely remember reading a few positive reviews on it a while back. Does anyone have any experience with it?

[Ironmonger]

Browning BAR in 7mm Remington Magnum. *drools*

[Frost]

And so the long-dead thread is dug up and revived

[Ironmonger]

Frost can back me up on this one.

Spoiler:

[CamoBadger]

Continuing on from the OOC.


@Frost: Sir, rare? I've seen a Five Seven at almost every gun store I've been to in Colorado, and 5 at a gun show just 2 weeks ago. The ammo on the other hand...less easy to find and not cheap.
Underpowered? It fires a rifle round.
Also, you best not be knocking revolvers. They beat the hell out of almost every semi that fires the same round. And they're a hell of a lot more fun to shoot too.

Edit: Also, what is up with you people and your damn Italian guns? German, Belgian and American engineering are far superior.

[Frost]

Well, yes, because it's quite rare to find a semi-auto that fires a revolver round. However, 9 times out of 10, you put a .45 or a 9mm or two in someone, they ain't gettin' back up, especially not if you place your shots right. I think I'll disagree that reloading every six shots is more fun to shoot.

And yes, the Five-seveN fires rifle rounds. In the same way that a the 1911 or any Beretta does, since PDW's and SMG's apparently count as rifles

[CamoBadger]

Actually, the Five Seven fires an ACTUAL rifle round: 5.56.
And anyone who says PDW's and SMG's are rifles needs to be sterilized for the good of the future.

And on that comment about a 9mm taking someone down in 1 or 2 shots, I respectfully disagree. It doesn't carry enough power to knock back anyone older than 12, and moves so fast it goes straight through. There's a reason a lot of military and police hate that round.
And yes, revolvers are more fun in my opinion. There's more to shooting than seeing how accurate you can be or how fast you can shoot without stopping. Revolvers take more strength and practice to use effectively, so it makes it more challenging and engaging than just pulling the trigger and laughing at non-existent recoil from a lot of new-age semis.

[Frost]

Personally, I'm accurate with a 9mm to the point where I can rapid-fire from a good 15 yards and expect to get a heart- or head-shot within the first three rounds, in part thanks to the "non-existent" recoil. That not being on moving targets, however, I'd be grateful for the 15-20 round capacity of a good 9mm as well.

The Five-seveN shoots 5.56*28, if memory serves. That's quite shortened from the intermediate-caliber 5.56*45.

You want to talk Belgian guns? How about



The FNP .45 Tactical. 15-round, .45 ACP. All ambidextrous controls. A very common mod you'll see is a small reflex sight that can be mounted right onto the slide while still keeping zero. The barrel is already threaded to accept a suppressor, compensator, or what-have-you

[CamoBadger]

That would be good to have if I cared for any of those features. .45 I'm 'eh' on.
Ambidextrous controls are 'eh' as well. It's possible to get used to firing lefty with enough practice, I don't see a reason to spend extra for 'special' levers and shit to make it ambidextrous.

And for fun time, my rant about any sight that isn't centered on the top of any gun every made (not including lasers of course):

They are retarded.

Call me old fashioned, but I fail to see a purpose of holding the gun in an unnatural and uncomfortable position just because I have a special sight in a special place, instead of just looking down the normal sights.

Not that a pistol really needs sights anyways since 90% of using it is just point-and-shoot instead of 'waste time looking through the sights'.

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