Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

[Guest]

It could be that it eats the pony-slurry, yes... or it could be that the creation of the city, the maintenance of it, is actually part of what it desires - the structure and grandeur and order of it. Both are creepy, to me.

[Scienza]

THEY'RE MAKING A REAPER!

Surprisingly plausible! (And hilarious.) Proooobably not gonna happen that way, though. Anyways, I think the drains are so that the EoS can eat the liquified remains of everything it killed in the city. It's an omnicidal monster, why wouldn't it?

The Reaper explanation carries even farther when you think about it. What do the Reapers do? They eliminate sentient species and civilizations for unknowable reasons. JUST LIKE THE ZEBRA CITY IN THE HOOFINGTON VALLEY, LEAVING BEHIND ONLY RELICS AND RUINS.

They also indoctrinate and brainwash organic subjects, replacing large portions of their anatomy with cybernetics in order to facilitate their dark purposes...

No comment.

[O. Hinds]

The only reasons I don't have one of those "I believe in Somber" buttons are that I'm hoping that being on the team is enough of the clue and I, ah, wasn't able to find the link.

? It might be just because I use firefox, but you can right-click an image and select 'copy image location' to get the url of that image.

...
Um.
Yes, this would appear to be a thing that works. A rather obvious one. :D

Thanks. :)

[O. Hinds]

And there we go. Hopefully it's not a problem that I resized it; my signature was already a bit long.

[Silver136]

THEY'RE MAKING A REAPER!

Surprisingly plausible! (And hilarious.) Proooobably not gonna happen that way, though. Anyways, I think the drains are so that the EoS can eat the liquified remains of everything it killed in the city. It's an omnicidal monster, why wouldn't it?

Well that actually got me to thinking...the goal of the Eater is just to wipe out life right? So what if the drains are meant to keep the city clean so that it can attract ponies more easily? After all, the Harbingers want to find a way in, and a gore filled hellhole wouldn't be very attractive once they make it. Maybe the Eater knows this, and wants to fool them into a sense of security.

[Exodus Hero]

THEY'RE MAKING A REAPER!

Surprisingly plausible! (And hilarious.) Proooobably not gonna happen that way, though. Anyways, I think the drains are so that the EoS can eat the liquified remains of everything it killed in the city. It's an omnicidal monster, why wouldn't it?

The Reaper explanation carries even farther when you think about it. What do the Reapers do? They eliminate sentient species and civilizations for unknowable reasons. JUST LIKE THE ZEBRA CITY IN THE HOOFINGTON VALLEY, LEAVING BEHIND ONLY RELICS AND RUINS.

They also indoctrinate and brainwash organic subjects, replacing large portions of their anatomy with cybernetics in order to facilitate their dark purposes...

No comment.

Harbingers? Reapers? Strange beings from the stars? The liquidation of ponies and Omnicide of an intelligent race? Main character altered by cybernetics after death? The rabbit hole indeed goes deep...

[SilentCarto]

Worse, the existence of drains leads inexorably to the next question -- why bother?  That's a lot of effort to go to.  What benefit comes of draining off the... fluid? We can presume that the planner behind the drains was the same one who secretly rushed construction. We can presume reparasprites (thanks, Carto!) are the instrument of the construction work, but on whose orders? Horse? Cogs? The Eater itself?  ...Who benefits from drains?

Cogs is probably the one who ordered the work. Good catch on the repairasprites being the method of construction, but the Eater itself has never shown any interest in talking to anyone, if it's even capable of thought beyond the instinct to consume. (Hoofington Rises...) It seems to me this is a situation similar to the Star Blaster -- the stars (or the things in the gulf between the stars) offer the means, but it's ponykind who inflicts suffering on themselves. As such, I don't see the Eater ordering around construction bots -- that's a job for a mad supercomputer.

As for what the slurry is for... the Reaper idea may not be that far off. What would a crazy computer that thinks it's Luna -- or Nightmare Moon -- want? A body, right?

But, Dawn mentioned that Cogs seems to want BJ for some grand destiny. I would assume that destiny is "be the vessel for the Goddess". In which case she wouldn't need pony slurry. But, then, maybe she was looking forward to the day when she had a body and the Core would be her palace. You don't want millions of gallons of dead pony in your palace.

Edit: Ugh, another nasty idea. What if Cogs' upgrade path doesn't include a cyberstomach? What if Dawn -- and a hypothetical CyberBlackjackCogs -- aren't capable of eating normal food anymore? Liquefied pony would, naturally, contain everything a living pony would need...

let me first point out that they were called 'Mechasprites'.

Ah, thank you.

I'm probably still going to say 'repairasprites'. I like that name.  

[Scienza]

Eh, the thing I'm most interested in is Black Pony Mountain, personally.
I mean, uh, not interested in.
Because there's nothing interesting about it.
No.

Pfffttt... There's nothing interesting there. At all. That's why we're talking about Reapers and pony slurry. Because Black Pony Mountain is pretty dull. Nothing to be interested in there.

[FeatherDust]

If I am to say anything here, let me first point out that they were called 'Mechasprites'.

Repairasprites is funnier. Well... punnier, anyway, and that's nearly as good.

Second, I think that if the Eater was responsible for the quick construction of the city, then it's likely [he's] just trying to maintain it. The reason everything seems so out of place is that [he] has no ponies to guide [him] in where to put everything; after all, [he's] a star, you can't predict what [he] actually knows.

But you could say the same thing if it's an independent "city repair unit" computer that Cogs is tweaking to repurpose the city for her own reasons. Due to damage or hacking, it may have only partial records of the original design, or it might just be trying to fix things outside its scope. For example, a building falls halfway over to lean against the next one, and the non-intelligent repair computer can't figure out what that was originally supposed to be and has to make a best-guess.

Enervation comes from two different sources. The explosion of the 'green star's' magic is likely what makes living things and silver 'melt', and our Eater is what sucks the soul out of everything.

I don't really think so... I'm pretty sure the "green-spectrum star" was the Eater's original form exploding, which left behind the dark heart that ultimately crashed into pre-Equestria. Remember that the colors are only a metaphor for different parts of the magical spectrum; magical frequency is not visible light.

Worse, the existence of drains leads inexorably to the next question -- why bother?  That's a lot of effort to go to.  What benefit comes of draining off the... fluid?

THEY'RE MAKING A REAPER!

DAMN!  I should've realized that!

[Evilgidgit]

Eh, the thing I'm most interested in is Black Pony Mountain, personally.
I mean, uh, not interested in.
Because there's nothing interesting about it.
No.

Nope, nope. Nothing interesting there at all. There's no way that the mountain is really the hiding place for Project Redoubt or something like that. Nope. No way, Jose.

[FeatherDust]

Cogs seems to want BJ for some grand destiny. I would assume that destiny is "be the vessel for the Goddess".

"FOOLISH MORTAL. THERE IS ONLY ONE MAIDEN OF THE STARS, AND I AM SHE!"

[Dekshuduph]

Repairasprites is funnier.  Well... punnier, anyway, and that's nearly as good.

Regardless, their main purpose was to create stuff, so I'm still calling them 'Mechasprites'.

But you could say the same thing if it's an independent "city repair unit" computer that Cogs is tweaking to repurpose the city for her own reasons.  Due to damage or hacking, it may have only partial records of the original design, or it might just be trying to fix things outside its scope.  For example, a building falls halfway over to lean against the next one, and the non-intelligent repair computer can't figure out what that was originally supposed to be and has to make a best-guess.
I don't really think so... I'm pretty sure the "green-spectrum star" was the Eater's original form exploding, which left behind the dark heart that ultimately crashed into pre-Equestria.  Remember that the colors are only a metaphor for different parts of the magical spectrum; magical frequency is not visible light.

Fair enough.

THEY'RE MAKING A REAPER!

Buuut surely therre's another, better resource far more common than pony flesh to build a something like that... right?  Also, judging from the image, this is speaking of Mass Effect, but I knew absolutely nothing about it until today.  Yay wikis.

Eh, the thing I'm most interested in is Black Pony Mountain, personally.
I mean, uh, not interested in.
Because there's nothing interesting about it.
No.

If I were you, I'd show at least some interest in it; that's where we met Stygius so if the Batponies' home is near there, it'd come up if we see any more of him or Whisper.

[Scienza]

THEY'RE MAKING A REAPER!

Buuut surely therre's another, better resource far more common than pony flesh to build a something like that... right?  Also, judging from the image, this is speaking of Mass Effect, but I knew absolutely nothing about it until today.  Yay wikis.

Nah, Reapers are made out of 100% All-Natural liquefied sentient.

Cogs seems to want BJ for some grand destiny. I would assume that destiny is "be the vessel for the Goddess".

"FOOLISH MORTAL. THERE IS ONLY ONE MAIDEN OF THE STARS, AND I AM SHE!"

“I am the Harbinger of your ascendance.”

“You cannot escape your destiny, Shepard Blackjack.”

[Somber]

Oh gaaawd... DFAER#@R$F@#FD#...

I didn't even think of that...

[Moodyman90]

I think it's safe to that all the Mass Effect related idea is out the window haha. Shared based source maybe but unless I misinterpret Somber's post it wasn't intentional or planned.

[Stringtheory]

Oh gaaawd... DFAER#@R$F@#FD#...

I didn't even think of that...

But hey, you could totally pull off a triple way crossover and justify it as 'Just as Planned'   

[SilentCarto]

Enervation comes from two different sources.  The explosion of the 'green star's' magic is likely what makes living things and silver 'melt', and our Eater is what sucks the soul out of everything.

I don't really think so... I'm pretty sure the "green-spectrum star" was the Eater's original form exploding, which left behind the dark heart that ultimately crashed into pre-Equestria.

 
That doesn't make sense. The core would have had to travel at light speed to crash at the same time that the light from its own explosion hit Equestria.

It would be kind of interesting if the EoS's original death produced a sort of Enervation gamma ray burst, but that doesn't seem to be what's being explained here.

Remember that the colors are only a metaphor for different parts of the magical spectrum; magical frequency is not visible light.

The wavelengths appear to be linked, according to Moonshadow.

“We’d need to find fossilized tree rings, see when they absorbed this wavelength of light.  As of now it’s just a hypothesis.”

I would assume that's meant to refer to the "aura color" of unicorn magic. This might say some unsettling things about changelings.

I wonder what it says about Rainbow Dash...

If I were you, I'd show at least some interest in it; that's where we met Stygius so if the Batponies' home is near there, it'd come up if we see any more of him or Whisper.

Your sarcasm detector needs adjustment. Would it help if we appended this?  

Oh gaaawd... DFAER#@R$F@#FD#...

I didn't even think of that...

To be fair, we did keep referring to Cogs ASSUMING DIRECT CONTROL over Dawn back at the Battle of Chapel.  

[Valikdu]

Cogs seems to want BJ for some grand destiny. I would assume that destiny is "be the vessel for the Goddess".

"FOOLISH MORTAL. THERE IS ONLY ONE MAIDEN OF THE STARS, AND I AM SHE!"

as long as we're fooling around...

"THERE CAN BE ONLY ONE!"
*shwing*
*entire Core is blown up in the quickening*

[Guest]

The EQD page is kinda confusing, anyway to get that changed? So it reads the newest released chapter is 63 not 64?

[SilentCarto]

And now, responses to older posts.

Oh, and juuust on a side note: I've been re-reading the whole story, and I think - I think! - I know what Rampage is. 

Oh? What's your guess?

-P-21 and Tyrantscotch were great.

Yes, I failed to mention this in my review, but I really enjoyed seeing Scotch taking on a leadership role in Chapel and P-21 making a place for himself.

Or maybe [Enervation is] just the negative spell-function of Friendship. Given that Friendship is Magic and all.

That's an interesting idea. If this pervasive but incredibly weak Enervation has been hitting Equestria for centuries, perhaps the Tree of Harmony grew to counter it -- an immune response, if you will. Its own magic is just as subtle, but when the Elements are removed and their magic amplified by living ponies, they form a powerful force of healing and... well... Harmony.

[O. Hinds]

And now, responses to older posts.

Oh, and juuust on a side note: I've been re-reading the whole story, and I think - I think! - I know what Rampage is. 

Oh? What's your guess?

-P-21 and Tyrantscotch were great.

Yes, I failed to mention this in my review, but I really enjoyed seeing Scotch taking on a leadership role in Chapel and P-21 making a place for himself.

Or maybe [Enervation is] just the negative spell-function of Friendship. Given that Friendship is Magic and all.

That's an interesting idea. If this pervasive but incredibly weak Enervation has been hitting Equestria for centuries, perhaps the Tree of Harmony grew to counter it -- an immune response, if you will. Its own magic is just as subtle, but when the Elements are removed and their magic amplified by living ponies, they form a powerful force of healing and... well... Harmony.

As far as I know, we're not including the Tree of Harmony, and I don't see how we could.

[FeatherDust]

Cogs seems to want BJ for some grand destiny. I would assume that destiny is "be the vessel for the Goddess".

"FOOLISH MORTAL. THERE IS ONLY ONE MAIDEN OF THE STARS, AND I AM SHE!"

“I am the Harbinger of your ascendance.”
“You cannot escape your destiny, Shepard Blackjack.”

as long as we're fooling around...

I'm not fooling around and it's not a Mass Effect reference.

Blackjack is supposed to be the Maiden, but the Legate seems to have insider knowledge on that, and is sure that she has the potential but isn't there yet.  He expected the Maiden to be this cackling engine of destruction, but BJ isn't nearly there mentally, and I can't imagine her at this point throwing away all morality like that.  But now Cogs offers a new solution.

I'm going to assume that Cogs is, as seems clear, a copy of Luna's mind.  Cogs wants Blackjack specifically, not just EC-1101, and Nightmare Moon was the previous Maiden, so it seems likely that she wants BJ because of the Maiden connection.  It just got me thinking, maybe that's why Blackjack isn't properly the Maiden of the Stars yet (according to the Legate).  Maybe there's only one true Maiden, and fulfilling the Legate's "destiny" prediction means being taken over by Cognitum, to become the effective reincarnation of Nightmare Moon.

It's just a random wild mass guess, really.

[Borsuq]

And now, responses to older posts.

Oh, and juuust on a side note: I've been re-reading the whole story, and I think - I think! - I know what Rampage is. 

Oh? What's your guess?

Well, since you asked:

I'm 90% sure of it, so read at your own risk:

...

In case you're wondering "... what?!:

[Meleagridis]

I'm 90% sure of it, so read at your own risk:

...

In case you're wondering "... what?!:

Gruuuuu you got my hopes up and everything this answers nothing. We don't even know what Peppermint was, just that Shujaa didn't think it was a person but Twist might have (or the other way around, can't recall). Given how Twist got the talisman, it's safe to say that something she cared deeply about would get the same treatment (though damned if I know how Mint got it when Twist was dead in a tank a million miles away).

But even if Pepper is Rampage (still a big if) it still doesn't answer the question, just replace it:

"What is Peppermint?"

It's just a random wild mass guess, really.

Can't not accept this. One problem, though: Cogs seems all in favor of heavy duty cybernetic modification. Dawn is barely flesh, and Steel Rain worked hard to get on her good side to turn away augments. Why would she want a flesh and blood body if she has all this technology and no problem with being made of metal?

[FeatherDust]

"What is Peppermint?"

I'm guessing Peppermint was a blank. Possibly a smart blank like Boo, but a blank would best explain a serious and long-running argument about whether or not she's a person.

Or she's a cat and Twist was just kind of goofy.

But the fact that we heard fragments of that argument about Peppermint but it lacked vital specifics tends to argue that there's a secret there which we were purposely excluded from.

Cogs seems all in favor of heavy duty cybernetic modification. Dawn is barely flesh, and Steel Rain worked hard to get on her good side to turn away augments. Why would she want a flesh and blood body if she has all this technology and no problem with being made of metal?

I don't think BJ counts as "flesh and blood" anymore. Not much, anyway. But if you're saying "Why a highly modified organic instead of a Sweetie-bot style robot body?" I would have to suppose there's something special about being the Maiden.

Remember, Cogs is not Luna. She's a copy of Luna's brain. She can't use magic; she can't control the moon or enter dreams or any of Luna's other abilities. She remembers doing those things, but she can't because she's just a mind in a machine. If she wants to return to being the living Nightmare Moon or something like that, she'll need a partly organic body, and one that has the same mystical link to the stars that she had would seem like the best choice to me.

[Borsuq]

I'm 90% sure of it, so read at your own risk:

...

In case you're wondering "... what?!:

Gruuuuu you got my hopes up and everything this answers nothing. We don't even know what Peppermint was, just that Shujaa didn't think it was a person but Twist might have (or the other way around, can't recall). Given how Twist got the talisman, it's safe to say that something she cared deeply about would get the same treatment (though damned if I know how Mint got it when Twist was dead in a tank a million miles away).

But even if Pepper is Rampage (still a big if) it still doesn't answer the question, just replace it:

"What is Peppermint?"

Let me explain, then:

[Meleagridis]

Let me explain, then:

Spoiler:

Ah, crap, I forgot that she was in heat. And that sure would explain why Shujaa would be unhappy with her.

But it doesn't explain the stripes. Why would the talisman regenerate paint or dye? And why does she rapidly advance to mare after disintegration? And it still doesn't explain why Twist would drag her daughter around in a tank.

Interesting theory, but I can't buy into it yet.

(Oh, and everyone was influenced by the other souls- Remember poor Softheart, jumping in front of a train instead of killing her children?)

[FeatherDust]

(Oh, and everyone was influenced by the other souls- Remember poor Softheart, jumping in front of a train instead of killing her children?)

Influenced, yes, but none of the other subjects had Rampage's lack of personhood. Softheart knew she was Softheart, and knew that she was being influenced to do something very wrong. The talisman didn't override her personality or morals.

That's why I'm thinking Rampage is Peppermint the Blank; she didn't have a soul to start with, so she doesn't have a sense of "I" before the Phoenix Talisman's legion comes in.

[Meleagridis]

That's why I'm thinking Rampage is Peppermint the Blank; she didn't have a soul to start with, so she doesn't have a sense of "I" before the Phoenix Talisman's legion comes in.

This I think is more likely, and it opens up a more possibilities for the stripes as well, given the somewhat murky area of Blank genetics.
The question then becomes:

"Why did they have a blank?"

What ties them to Hippocratic? Did they have involvement in one of the Projects?

It also has more implications for poor Rampage, depending on her exact nature. It could be that (as theorized to death at one point) any blank can learn and develop personality if given time, such as by being cared for (Rampage) or some unprecedented gift of fortune (Boo). It could also be some kind of gestalt consciousness, the ghost of a personality that results as the interaction of anywhere between  twelve to a hundred competing thoughts and desires. If that's the case, then... dammit, why did we never get a Lacunae/Rampage one-on-one?

[Derpmind]

That doesn't make sense. The core would have had to travel at light speed to crash at the same time that the light from its own explosion hit Equestria.

It would be kind of interesting if the EoS's original death produced a sort of Enervation gamma ray burst, but that doesn't seem to be what's being explained here.

I could try going around the traditional way of eliminating all the other possibilities, but the original destruction of the EoS being such a large explosion as to throw pieces around at FTL speeds (through whatever-space) is sufficiently awesome that I think it's a perfectly viable explanation.

So this is just a random thought, but what if the EoS has been dying all these thousands of years? Not just being the last big shard of itself in existence, but also sorta doomed to never be able to pull itself together? Maybe the reason it makes avatars like that zebra and Luna is that it isn't just trying to make the intelligent life on the planet work for it, but that it also needs to resonate with souls that aren't completely subsumed to keep itself alive? Like, from that vision of the stars that BJ had we know that the stars kinda resonate with each other, and while the EoS tried to make absolutely everything resonate with it nowadays it needs to find a few souls to resonate with (like it used to before it went crazy) so it can stay alive in its present wrecked state.

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