Re: [Official!] Project Horizons Comment Crew Chat thread.

[Harmony Ltd.]

Morningwood Forest

[Frost]

Gentlemen

[Valikdu]

Gentlemen

Meet the Sparkle!:

[Frost]

Gentlemen

Meet the Sparkle!:

Yeah, I could see Twilight taking up a profession involving shoving things in her mouth

[Frost]

Said profession being "Prostitute."

[Harmony Ltd.]

*badum-tish*

[WovenTales]

Hey Hinds, you got any headcanons stationed around San Frantello? (Question also applicable to anyone else who may have come up with anything) A combination of working on the plates of the worldmap and several not insignificant changes in planning my story have moved it from somewhere around the mountains I had in your Sea of Equestria to something that actually fits with what you already have. Last I heard about that area was Caoimhe suggesting the name, but I might have missed a reference or you could have thought of something without posting it, and while I make no guarantees that I'll follow what you might give me, it could be fun to fit something else in. Just a bit more depth to the world. Also, those are mountains just to the northeast, right?

...Someone else is actually planning on using my map?! Yay!

Um... Yes, I'd say that I have a few bits of headcanon around San Frantello. :) What sorts of information about it do you need?

Yes, those are mountains.

I'm not really looking for anything specific; that was mainly asking if you had anything you'd like seeing included—or alternatively, not contradicted—when (if) I ever get around to writing it. I love how detailed some of your headcanons can get, and I'd rather not ruin anything you've put a lot of work into (or are otherwise attached to) if I can help it. Send me whatever you want me to read through, and I'll see what matches with how I'm imagining the setting.

And I was mostly just making sure with the mountains. The colors on the map are relatively clear when comparing them to each other, but the isolated swatches on the key don't do too much to clear up any remaining questions. Really, though, that's the first thing I've found on either map that I've had any trouble understanding.

EDIT: I see you've already started. Great! Sorry for taking so long—I was having some trouble with the wording for this, and am enough of a perfectionist to want to take the extra time to get it right.

[O. Hinds]

@WovenTales:
Ah, thanks.

Started? Oh, what additional information would you like? I imagine that most Wastelanders, if they think of it at all, know it as "that place without the cloud ceiling but with the army of zebras that will shoot you if you bother them". It is possible for a Wasteland trader to deal with them, though, if done properly (and it could be very profitable if the trader had scavenged or otherwise acquired something that they want).

[WovenTales]

Started posting information, started without me, something along those lines, though I could have worded it better.

*snip*:

A lot of that actually meshes amazingly well with what I had planned. Hadn't worked out the specifics yet, but I was already imagining the SPP tower was down. Still, I was thinking it would be the center for slavery in the area (not so much the destination like Fillydelphia, more management and records), slightly different from the wealth through petroleum and industry in your version of it.

How far does the GPE groundspace extend? I doubt it would be hard to put a smaller city somewhere around there. And it sounds like traders do have an advantage getting to Masozi? My characters were already going to be essentially hired onto a caravan, so that could wind up working well. Not everything needs to be a Chekhov's Gun, but I prefer if most things I mention have some later appearance.

[Harmony Ltd.]

In the last chapter of PH we've been able to see the old frontline, and that there's a lot of stuff still laying there on the ground.

I wonder what kind of things you could scavenge from the old battlefield, how dangerous it would be (unexploded ordinances, taint, magical radiations...), and most of all how profitable it would be.


It seems that most everything of value has had time to rust away, but I guess if you found enough vehicles & tanks husks, you could do something...

We've been able to see that even a single tank (deus) was a game changer in the wasteland, so I'd imagine having only a dozen of relatively functional T-26/T-34-like vehicles, with fuel and ammunition, could turn you into a respectable warlord as long as you don't have to deal with the Enclave...

[Harmony Ltd.]

Though the Steel Rangers would probably start annoying you...

[Harmony Ltd.]

Or heck, with the number of robot wrecks there would be on the battlefield, you could surely find a market of selling spare parts to the Remnants and the Steel Rangers alike.

[O. Hinds]

A lot of that actually meshes amazingly well with what I had planned. Hadn't worked out the specifics yet, but I was already imagining the SPP tower was down. Still, I was thinking it would be the center for slavery in the area (not so much the destination like Fillydelphia, more management and records), slightly different from the wealth through petroleum and industry in your version of it.

Oh, nice! A note, though: that wealth of petroleum and industry doesn't really affect the Wasteland much until, well, it isn't the Wasteland anymore. The Wastelanders who succeed in trading with them can come away with relatively large quantities of fresh (or newly preserved) food, newly-manufactured consumer goods, medicine, or small arms, but there aren't that many traders who do that (in part due to those who've been able to do it not doing much to fight the rumors that the Miliozi, say, shoot ponies on sight). The major problem is finding things that the Miliozi/Alliance actually want; they don't take caps, and a lot of salvage that would ordinarily be very valuable in the Wasteland is worthless to them. Except for some rare or unique pieces of information or technology, they'll probably need to be paid in large quantities or high qualities of gems (Equestrian gems being something that the Alliance wants but is poor in; they've got secret trade agreements with the hellhounds, but they could still use more).

How far does the GPE groundspace extend? I doubt it would be hard to put a smaller city somewhere around there. And it sounds like traders do have an advantage getting to Masozi? My characters were already going to be essentially hired onto a caravan, so that could wind up working well. Not everything needs to be a Chekhov's Gun, but I prefer if most things I mention have some later appearance.

It definitely extends to the borders of the active SPP cells, but unfortunately I don't know where those are. It definitely extends no farther than the old city limits of San Frantello... but I'm not sure where those are, either.

A smaller city somewhere around there... I hadn't thought of that, but it's an interesting idea. Being a "city" by Wasteland standards, perhaps it's an old suburb further up the bay? I'm not sure how the Miliozi would take that, though. I'm not entirely clear on what this city you want is meant to do.

Not so much "an advantage" as "a chance"; the Miliozi aren't even too keen on tourists from the rest of the Alliance, much less from the Equestrian Wasteland. The only people that they might let in are traders and diplomats, and they can't really deal with non-hellhound diplomats from any of the Wasteland powers due to the Alliance officially recognizing the GPE as the government of their (the GPE's) claimed territory (the hellhound thing is also technically a violation, but the GPE doesn't really know about it and would probably turn a blind eye if it did, at least until it starts trying to mindcontrol hellhounds).

[O. Hinds]

In the last chapter of PH we've been able to see the old frontline, and that there's a lot of stuff still laying there on the ground.

I wonder what kind of things you could scavenge from the old battlefield, how dangerous it would be (unexploded ordinances, taint, magical radiations...), and most of all how profitable it would be.


It seems that most everything of value has had time to rust away, but I guess if you found enough vehicles & tanks husks, you could do something...

We've been able to see that even a single tank (deus) was a game changer in the wasteland, so I'd imagine having only a dozen of relatively functional T-26/T-34-like vehicles, with fuel and ammunition, could turn you into a respectable warlord as long as you don't have to deal with the Enclave...

Interesting idea. I think, though, that "fuel and ammunition" might be an insurmountable difficultly (or not, depending on how Equestrian tanks worked).

Or heck, with the number of robot wrecks there would be on the battlefield, you could surely find a market of selling spare parts to the Remnants and the Steel Rangers alike.

...Maybe, but, were I a trader attempting that, I'd be a bit worried that the Remnant or Rangers would offer to either accept my generous donation or pay me in individual express-delivered bullets. Trading with Red Eye would be a much safer bet and therefore much more profitable.

[Valikdu]

This exists.

RIIIISE FROM YOUR GRAAAAVE:

[Ironmonger]

This exists.

RIIIISE FROM YOUR GRAAAAVE:

I have mixed feelings about this.

[Guest]

That feel when you're all set to spend a week going through a webcomic's archives, and it only takes like an hour because it's a relatively new webcomic. :(

[Harmony Ltd.]

I had an idea for a story set after the Sunshine & Rainbows...


What's peoples headcanons regarding :

- The New Canterlot Republic
- What happened of Fillydelphia after the fall of Red Eye
- What happened to the Grand Pegasus Enclave


I don't have much ideas concerning the NCR (well, some, but they aren't really matured), so I'll say what I have in mind for the two others :


Fillydelphia :

Almost immediately after the fall of Red Eye, without a charismatic central figure to unite them, the various raiders and slavers quickly devolved into competing gangs, some of them led by people like Protégé from MN7 - Red Eye's "students" ; and others by the likes of Chainlink Shackles & Wicked Slit - the ruthless raiders & slavers kind. Mostly, Red Eye's forces fractured along the lines of those who believed in his Greater Good, and those who where just in it for the booty. It further fractured along the line of the various strong personalities in these two "camps", mostly depending on their interpretations of the Greater Good for Red Eye's students.

They fought, and fought dirty to control the wealth of Fillydelphia's industry, and this for a few years until most of them died, from the combats, hunger or disease.

Ten years after the fall of Red Eye, the New Canterlot Republic launch an operation to reclaim the city with its nascent army, supported by squads of veteran griffins and Applejack Rangers, and with a contingent of Followers of the Apocalypse.

Among this force is a number of kids who grew in Red Eye's care and who managed to escape the city with some of the scientists and other qualified peoples Red Eye employed - roughly half of them (kids & other) managed to escape, the others being enslaved by the gangs or killed by the slaves-turned-raiders/cannonfodder. They are the ones who convinced the NCR to try to reclaim the city, and most of them are in the Follower of the Apocalypse contingent.


Grand Pegasus Enclave :

Following the Day of Sunshine and Rainbows, the Enclave's society fell into chaos as roughly three different camps formed themselves :

1) "The Volunteers" : The ones who were scandalized to learn how the Enclave had been treating the surface and wished for it to correct its course and help the surface to the best of its ability (I guess its leaders would mostly come from the Volunteer Corp)
2) "The Bitters" / "Cauterizers" : The ones who were crying for the blood of the surfacers who were threatening their way of life and all they had ever fought for, and were ready to fight to the bloody end to stop Littlepip from breaking the cloud cover (probably led by the hardliners of the Enclave military leadership who most supported Operation Cauterize)
3) "The Isolationnists" : And finally those who just wished to continue to live as they did before and not care about the fate of those dirty surfacers

Soon it fell into a civil war, the Second Group launching itself into a campaign of terror against the rest of the wasteland, a campaign which would only definitively end with their complete (?) eradication fifteen years after the DoS&R, the First Group helping the surface against Second Group to the best of its abilities, and the Third Group playing the First and Second Groups against each others and staying low to be left in peace as much as possible.

Twenty years after the Day of Sunshine and Rainbows, it's pretty safe to say that the Grand Pegasus Enclave as it was known has ceased to exist. It has only left to the Wasteland most of its technology, as it was either salvaged by the Volunteers, stolen from the Bitters or traded from the Isolationnists ; and generations worth of resentment among the pegasus, murders born of revenge being relatively common between the three different groups.

Even if they have officially surrendered and faded away into the Wasteland, some claim that there still exist remnants of the Bitters, bidding their time to one day claim back Equestria.



New Canterlot Republic :

What started as Gawdwyna Grimfeather trying to organize her own turf of the Wasteland in a fairer way than what had been done before quickly gained steam as refugees flew in (what was the name of that penal facility complex again ?), in the hope of a better life at first, and quickly simply to find safety from the Bitter's War on the Wasteland.

The Bitter War made much to unite and strengthen the nascent Republic, as on one side the new citizens had a common enemy to fight against, and on the other if they didn't give their best to fight said enemy they would lose everything, even their life.

A few years into the Bitter War (which "officially" started with the destruction of Friendship City, the start of Operation Cauterize), the then disorganized rabble tasked to defend the NCR was turned into its army, all able bodied citizens being mobilized and trained by the cadres of the young NCR Army, mostly ex-Talon mercenaries and Applejack Rangers. Those who couldn't fight were mobilized to tend to the fields, build & repair the guns of those who could fight and supply them with ammunition and medical gear.

At first the NCR Army seemed hopelessly outmatched by the Bitters, their gear and training not being up to the task of fighting a force in top-shape and armed with energy weapons and warships, their casualty rate being of 5-7 to 1 in their best battles ; the tide only beginning to shift once the Volunteers started putting their resources & training at the disposition of the war effort.

Five years into the war, what the Bitters had hoped would be a swift blitzkrieg had turned into a, well, bitter war of attrition. And they were starting to lose, the few ships they had either having been destroyed of starting to fall apart from disrepair, their equipment doing as well, and their resources dwindling.

A few more years in, the final victory of the NCR had become unquestionnable, but still the Bitters continued to fight, their struggle turning into guerilla warfare as they attacked the various caravans of the Republic and generally making themselves a pain in the ass. It's around this time that they started a full-on campaign of biological warfare. It wasn't pretty.

Their activities dwindled away, and exactly fifteen years after the Start of Operation Cauterize, no attack by the Bitters had been registered since 6 month. It's as if they had simply disappeared.

The fifteenth anniversary of the start of Operation Cauterize is considered as the official end of the Bitter War, and since then that day has become a National Holiday for the Republic.

All things considered, as bloody as it was (seriously, it was a nightmare), the NCR wouldn't exist without the Bitter War - or at least it wouldn't have become as strong as it is now, the dominant power in the Equestrian Wastes and on its way to one day restore the glory of Equestria.


As far as how it treats the affairs of the wastes, it has been greatly influenced by the Bitter War, trying to recruit as many people as they can and trying to integrate them into the melting-pot that is the Republic. As for those who refuse to join... well, that's a question for another day...

[Ironmonger]

*slowly claps*

I like the idea so far, other than that I really don't have much to add.

[O. Hinds]

@Harmony Ltd.:
Interesting; so your headcanon has the former Red Eye forces winning the Battle of Fillydelphia? How? IIRC, the last we saw of it was looking like a rout for the defenders.

"what was the name of that penal facility complex again"
Shattered Hoof, named after but far away from the ridge.


Myself, you've probably gathered that I've a few ideas, but I'm expecting to have them shaken up by the ending of PH and am therefore keeping them a bit uncertain at the moment. I will say that I'm, under my current thinking (thought of this morning, in fact, IIRC), expecting the NCR military to be, at least at first, built on small-unit tactics. I also have the NCR's immediate future after the first decade post-SR being defined in large part by the economic war with the Alliance.

[Harmony Ltd.]

My idea, in short, was that Red Eye's forces retreated inside the city, turning the battle into a siege.

After the fall of the Cathedral and that retreat, with the new of Red Eye's demise, the infighting quickly began in the rank of the Fillydelphia slavers - quickly being in the hours following the new of the battle of the Cathedral's Battle being lost reaching them.

In the ensuing chaos, the slaves rioted, freed themselves, and proceeded to wreak havoc in the besieged Fillydelphia.

From the exterior, in the besiegers point of view, it had become clear that Red Eyes forces had become neutered as an effective fighting force, and in the light of the slave revolt, decided to stay outside the City : not really a glorious decision, but on the other hand the slaves were so frenzied they didn't make any difference as to who they took out their desire of revenge on, attacking everyone without distinction, even each others.

Then a few weeks after the start of the siege, and in the continuation of Operation Cauterize (still in full force even after the loss of I don't remember how many Raptors in the various battles), the besiegers decided to focus toward the fight against the enclave, abandoning the siege.

The besieged were a bit too busy killing each other to really take notice of that. They contented themselves by launching raids in the surrounding areas to try to get some food in their plates.

That... didn't go too well (the last months of Fillydelphia ended in cannibalism).



When the Fillydelphia Reclamation Corp reach the city ten years after the end of the Siege, the only traces of life left in the city is ghouls, tainted parasprites, and the few odd survivors who barely have any trace of equinity left in them from all the bloodshed and horrors they had to go through - you could almost take them for feral ghouls, if it weren't for the fact that they look a -little- better, and are far less friendly.

[Harmony Ltd.]

A dozen miles or so out of the city limits, a little community of scavengers took life around a train station of the old commuting rail network of Pre-War Fillydelphia, with a few dozen scavengers living there in relative safety, the station being above-ground.

The Fillydelphia Reclamation Corp "requesitionned" it as its headquarter, and the scavengers as their guides in their effort to... well, scavenge the city of things valuable to the Republic.

In 30 A.S (Year Thirty After Sunshine, thirty years after the Day of Sunshine and Rainbows), it's the most important settlement in the Fillydelphia area, with around two to four thousand people working in shifts days and night to salvage from Fillydelphia anything they can, going as far as trying to slavage the blast furnaces themselves, in order to build the new Capital (and hopefully economic and manufacturing center) of the Republic.

[Harmony Ltd.]

Can you give me a bit more details about the relations between the NCR and the Alliance ?

[tylertoon2]

I had an idea for a story set after the Sunshine & Rainbows...


What's peoples headcanons regarding :

- The New Canterlot Republic
- What happened of Fillydelphia after the fall of Red Eye
- What happened to the Grand Pegasus Enclave

You might want to re read the ten years later afterword Harmony. As I recall Fillydelphia had already been reclaimed and part of the NCR and Equestria was mostly at peace.

Unless I am mistaken.

[Harmony Ltd.]

Concerning the Republic itself, here's a thing I had in mind :


It is born from the Wasteland, has been raised by a Warlord (Gawdwyna), and forged in the fires of War.

As such, the mortar of the Republic is its Military. Universal Conscription is still the rule, and the Republic tend to approach most of its problems. with the same question : "Can it hurt me, and if yes, how do I subvert or destroy it ?".

There is a Senate, and the Republic is nominally a Parliamentary Republic / Federation of Settlements ; but the Military still get the final say in most affairs.

This doesn't stop it from being riddled with political intrigues at every level.


The Republic is in no way an Utopia. It's simply Civilization, a thing that the Wasteland had lacked for a long time.

[tylertoon2]

Concerning the Republic itself, here's a thing I had in mind :


It is born from the Wasteland, has been raised by a Warlord (Gawdwyna), and forged in the fires of War.

As such, the mortar of the Republic is its Military. Universal Conscription is still the rule, and the Republic tend to approach most of its problems. with the same question : "Can it hurt me, and if yes, how do I subvert or destroy it ?".

There is a Senate, and the Republic is nominally a Parliamentary Republic / Federation of Settlements ; but the Military still get the final say in most affairs.

This doesn't stop it from being riddled with political intrigues at every level.


The Republic is in no way an Utopia. It's simply Civilization, a thing that the Wasteland had lacked for a long time.

So a state similar to Israel or Switzerland? Poses an Interesting look at it.
I'm not so sure about that. Figured it would be more democratic than that but on the other hand it seems like something that Gawdania would back. Certainly better than what was before.

[Ironmonger]

Picture related:

[Harmony Ltd.]

Well, in practice it is pretty democratic (by Wasteland standards) at the local level, but simply the higher you go in the spheres of power, the more important to the Republic as a whole the affairs you are talking about are, the more the Military will be paying close attention to the affairs in question and suggest to the Parliament what decisions to take.

There's a few currents in the military, those who want to take a more direct approach to governing the Republic, those who are content with the current situation, those who would want to hand over more control to the civilian authorities (they are few), and those who just don't give a fuck about politics (they are the majority).

You might want to re read the ten years later afterword Harmony. As I recall Fillydelphia had already been reclaimed and part of the NCR and Equestria was mostly at peace.

Unless I am mistaken.

Just did. I don't think I've seen any mention of Fillydelphia at all. And even then, not to insult Kkat's writing, but I don't believe even in ten years the city could be pacified / claimed back. At worst, take that as one of the (potentially numerous depending on what I'll come up with) break with FoE's "canon". [*]

As for a peaceful Wasteland, we're shown a city which is close to the Core of the Republic, in its most secure region,
and when Fluttershy say (paraphrase) "we haven't seen raiders in years", I understand it as "in the region". Apparently the roads farther from the Core are still rather unsafe (which the comments about Ditzy's caravan might support).

Anyway, it is said that "three years ago" (so in 7 A.S) Littlepip got rid of the last portion of the Cloud cover.

So I'd say that :

5 A.S is the year where the Bitters finally start crumbling, so much that by 7 A.S they are routed from their last bastion in the Clouds, and are forced down to the ground.
By the end of 8 A.S, between desertion and attrition, there's only a few thousands Bitters left around Equestria, fighting guerilla warfare. In the two following years most most of them die out - be it in the Republic's counter attacks or from disease / hunger.
After that, around 10 A.S (the time of the epilogue), there still a few occasional attacks against caravans by the Bitters around Equestria, but they now are merely an annoyance in the grand scheme of things. And in a few years, they will completely disappear from everyone's radars.



[*] : to be quite honest, even after the Sunshine and Rainbows AND the Gardens of Equestria, I still don't see the Wasteland as being even "mostly pacified" in ten years. There's just too much shit around for even half of it to be sorted out in that timespan.

[Ironmonger]

I have to agree with the last statement, all Gardens did was remove taint, magical radiation, and make it so that crops could grow properly, IIRC. It's still the wasteland, like it or lump it, beasties and all.

As for breaking canon, one can avoid that if they piece part and examine the exact statements in the story. If it doesn't contradict that, you're good to go, because even though an author means this or that, it may not be what they said.

Heil, technicalities!

PS: I don't know if I'm being helpful.

[Harmony Ltd.]

You know, my official statement about canon, not just in Fallout Equestria but also pretty much any franchise is the following :

I don't give a fuck


I just try to respect what I consider to be the spirit of the thing and its major plot points. As long as it respects the core themes of the work, it's okay in my book.

And if I ask Hinds questions about the Alliance, it's to know how they could influence my own ideas for a story if I ever chose to include them.

At worst, consider that it's an "alternate future" with the point of divergence set around the Day of Sunshine and Rainbows and just roll with it.

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