Re: [Official!] Project Horizons Comment Crew Chat thread.

[Guest]

Those games I'm interested in playing, I love Jade Empire and Mass Effect.

[iLateralGX]

I am in the same boat as Last, never even seen the movies. 

I actually haven't even played the games either.

[Stringtheory]

Watched all of the Star Wars movies, personally think the original trilogy's good if you like hero's journey with fantasy archetypes in space, while the prequel trilogy is popcorn status at best.
Star Wars Battlefront was one of the only FPS's I had for a long time (curse only having macs and no consoles...), so it has a special place in my heart, while the second one has a pretty good story (always liked seeing the imperials' perspective on things) and the space combat make it even more awesome.
Just bought KotOR 1 and while the combat is...weird (or shit, if I'm being unkind). The dialogue is pretty good and I can definitely see the influence on Mass Effect (which I'm also just playing).

[Scienza]

Watched all of the Star Wars movies, personally think the original trilogy's good if you like hero's journey with fantasy archetypes in space, while the prequel trilogy is popcorn status at best.
Star Wars Battlefront was one of the only FPS's I had for a long time (curse only having macs and no consoles...), so it has a special place in my heart, while the second one has a pretty good story (always liked seeing the imperials' perspective on things) and the space combat make it even more awesome.
Just bought KotOR 1 and while the combat is...weird (or shit, if I'm being unkind). The dialogue is pretty good and I can definitely see the influence on Mass Effect (which I'm also just playing).

My personal recommendation would be to play KOTOR 2, which is just awesome. It's easily one of the best things to come out of the Expanded Universe. The combat is still weird (since it's largely the same), but when it's good... One of my favorite elements is how you can corrupt your party members to the dark side.

In case you folks haven't gathered, I'm a huge SW nerd, in large part because I grew up with the films and the EU. I love the shit out of Star Wars. It's fun, it's epic, it's got so much lore that they had to seal all of it in an alternate universe just so that Disney could make more of it. It's got plenty of problems, but for me at least, it's worth it.

Also, Mandalorians kick ass.

[Stringtheory]

Watched all of the Star Wars movies, personally think the original trilogy's good if you like hero's journey with fantasy archetypes in space, while the prequel trilogy is popcorn status at best.
Star Wars Battlefront was one of the only FPS's I had for a long time (curse only having macs and no consoles...), so it has a special place in my heart, while the second one has a pretty good story (always liked seeing the imperials' perspective on things) and the space combat make it even more awesome.
Just bought KotOR 1 and while the combat is...weird (or shit, if I'm being unkind). The dialogue is pretty good and I can definitely see the influence on Mass Effect (which I'm also just playing).

My personal recommendation would be to play KOTOR 2, which is just awesome. It's easily one of the best things to come out of the Expanded Universe.

In case you folks haven't gathered, I'm a huge SW nerd, in large part because I grew up with the films and the EU. I love the shit out of Star Wars. It's fun, it's epic, it's got so much lore that they had to seal all of it in an alternate universe just so that Disney could make more of it. It's got plenty of problems, but for me at least, it's worth it.

Also, Mandalorians kick ass.

Yeah, there's plenty of awesomeness in the SW universe, but like any big franchise there's also a fair bit of shit too.

Can you play KotOR 2 first (and understand everything) and not totally spoil 1? Because I might just do that if the combat's less shit than 1. Or is there some easy way to bypass/win the combat in 1 without having to resort to quick saving before every single battle?

[Ironmonger]

1 or 2? Or both?
I'm not sure which I liked better, but 2 is pretty cool if you get the KOTOR2 restoration patch.
I've played both of those lots of times. Not much of any other star wars thinger.

I was pretty into star wars until I just got sick of how messy and over-dramatic it was.

I've played and beat only the first one. For a while, I used to spend hours at a time playing it and drawing stuff from it because it was all I had to do.

[Scienza]

My personal recommendation would be to play KOTOR 2, which is just awesome.

Also, Mandalorians kick ass.

Okay, so... what is their deal? How did they ever get to be so big and powerful for that war?
'Cause the story from KOTOR 2 was they were a culture of jackasses that killed people just to get them, hopefully, to fight back. Then, when that strategy lead to them finally getting broken (which they were just so very happy about), they turned into mercenaries who essentially did the same stuff as before... just now for money.
And then Canderous wanted to get back to their "glorious" history of killing people for sport again and you help him because you really don't have any choice in the matter.

It just seems impossible that they became so big and powerful when they just want to fight until everyone (especially themselves) is dead.

There's a lot more there. In a nutshell, their culture is based around a shared set of ideals, largely focusing around family and honor. They don't give a damn about species, homeworld, background. Anyone who chooses to join them is equally welcome. They're not good people, they've committed horrific atrocities, but they won't fuck you over with a smile like the Republic will.

It also helps that they've got (mostly) lightsaber-proof armor and they have a propensity to carry very big guns. They also look so damn cool.

Yeah, there's plenty of awesomeness in the SW universe, but like any big franchise there's also a fair bit of shit too.

Can you play KotOR 2 first (and understand everything) and not totally spoil 1? Because I might just do that if the combat's less shit than 1. Or is there some easy way to bypass/win the combat in 1 without having to resort to quick saving before every single battle?

Probably not. As Swicked mentioned, there's basically a "This is what happened in the previous game" section at the beginning.

[Tytan]

This might be some of the greatest anime goodness I've ever seen.

[Stringtheory]

Can you play KotOR 2 first (and understand everything) and not totally spoil 1? Because I might just do that if the combat's less shit than 1. Or is there some easy way to bypass/win the combat in 1 without having to resort to quick saving before every single battle?

Probably not. As Swicked mentioned, there's basically a "This is what happened in the previous game" section at the beginning.

Okay, so is there an easy way to beat/survive the combat without resorting to saving before every fight?

[Scienza]

Can you play KotOR 2 first (and understand everything) and not totally spoil 1? Because I might just do that if the combat's less shit than 1. Or is there some easy way to bypass/win the combat in 1 without having to resort to quick saving before every single battle?

Probably not. As Swicked mentioned, there's basically a "This is what happened in the previous game" section at the beginning.

Okay, so is there an easy way to beat/survive the combat without resorting to saving before every fight?

It's not that bad. The key is just speccing your party out properly. It's an RPG, so following the standard RPG roles of Tank, Healer, DPS, and/or Area of Effect is a pretty good option. It's a bit more flexible than that, since you can dual-class about halfway through the game and Jedi can fit into any one of a number of different roles (one party I ran with a lot in KoTOR 2 had Mandalore on the big gun, Kreia doing AOE, and my Exile going nuts up-close). This is especially true since 2 lets you effectively dual-class your followers by training them as Jedi. Make sure you upgrade your gear, stock up on healing items (or just make sure all your Jedi can heal), and you should be good to go.

The hardest parts of the games are ones in which they separate you from the other members of your party. My Exile was optimized as a striker, so she got wrecked a lot when there wasn't someone applying healing and passive bonuses.

[Stringtheory]

Can you play KotOR 2 first (and understand everything) and not totally spoil 1? Because I might just do that if the combat's less shit than 1. Or is there some easy way to bypass/win the combat in 1 without having to resort to quick saving before every single battle?

Probably not. As Swicked mentioned, there's basically a "This is what happened in the previous game" section at the beginning.

Okay, so is there an easy way to beat/survive the combat without resorting to saving before every fight?

It's not that bad. The key is just speccing your party out properly. It's an RPG, so following the standard RPG roles of Tank, Healer, DPS, and/or Area of Effect is a pretty good option. It's a bit more flexible than that, since you can dual-class about halfway through the game and Jedi can fit into any one of a number of different roles (one party I ran with a lot in KoTOR 2 had Mandalore on the big gun, Kreia doing AOE, and my Exile going nuts up-close). Make sure you upgrade your gear, stock up on healing items (or just make sure all your Jedi can heal), and you should be good to go.

Ah, I'm still back on the first planet, so it looks like I'll just have to quicksave often until I can get a decent party.

[Scienza]

Ah, Taris. You're going to be doing a lot of seemingly unconnected side-quests before you get off that damned rock. The rest of the game should pick up considerably after that.

Also, IIRC, you pick up nearly all of the possible party members there, so you shouldn't be waiting for too long. The only ones you can't grab there are proto-Jack and the two best damn characters in the game.

[Scienza]

I hate that first level. Bah. Yeah, once you have the freedom to decide what to do, it's SO much better.

And let's see, you get the scoundrel, kreia, and the handmaiden if you're a guy. If you're a girl you don't get the handmaiden, but the scholar guy on the jedi planet. The sith girl shows up on your ship, too... but does she that early? I don't recall. You get the droid, too.
You don't get HK and you don't get the nonlethal bounty hunter or the wookie (first if you're good, last if you're bad) until much later, let alone the big sphere guy. Nor the guy with the energy arm.
So "nearly all" is more like half, I think.

Aye, they're much more scattered in the second game. In the original, you get everyone but Jolee, HK, and Juhani on the first planet. Which is good, because it gives you a lot of flexibility relatively early on, but it also sucks because Taris takes forever. It's not quite as bad as the starting location of the second game (As much as I love KoTOR 2, I eventually cracked and installed a mod that allows me to skip it on subsequent playthroughs), but it's still painful.

Basically, once you get a lightsaber, the games get amazing.

Be sure to get the KOTOR2 restoration patch.
On the one hand, it makes it impossible to please everyone... in the original game, for example, you can get both the handmaiden and the sith girl to like you, train you in their respective skills, and make them really powerful in return.
After the patch, if you are nice to the sith girl, the handmaiden HATES you and completely shuts you out.

At the same time, though, it adds an entire planet/world, finishes quests and areas, and is just fantastic.

It just necessitates you to play the game multiple times to get the full experience.

Seconded so hard.

[Stringtheory]

Okay, good to know that more party members are coming soon. Hopefully I won't get tired of Taris too quickly, the high move speed, quick load times, and so far interesting locations and dialogue have all staved off the boredom of randomly wandering around trying to find the lower city, which was immediately switched to frustration at the combat, but maybe I just don't know how to pick my fights.

[Frost]

If I recall, there was a game in the works for the longest time (before eventual cancellation) that focused on pre-Clone Wars Outer Rim bounty hunters and such doing bounty-ish things and blaster-ing each other in the goddamn face as they zipped around with jetpacks and cyber-lemur-mounts (or what the fuck ever) with not a Force-user in sight.

Basically, the galaxy as 99.999% of its residents ever see it. Keep in mind that the Jedi, a few thousand strong, live on a world with, if memory serves, billions upon billions, even trillions, of inhabitants--and that's one world out of thousands. They're comparatively so rare that most people who meet a Jedi think either/or that, A.) they're faking being a Jedi, or B.) That the near-mythical Jedi (that no one they've ever even spoken to has actually seen, just heard rumors of.) Are nowhere near as powerful as they're rumored to be. And the Sith, well.....there's dozens of trillions of people in the Galaxy. There are two Sith, and, for the most part, only one is actually involved in galactic affairs (while maintaining a low profile) while the other directs and watches silently from the shadows.

[Scienza]

I know 1313 was supposed to be something like that (before it got canceled). I always found the non-Jedi perspective the most interesting.

[Cptadder]

THe Expanded Universe is even dumber than the movie-verse, and the movie verse is the kind of place where the villain is literally a cackling lightning-shooting old man and the coolest two guys in the series died in the (chronologically) first film.

You have to understand the Expanded Universe is a den of madness since writing for Star Wars back in the day just meant having a publisher on your side and paying your dues. Which produced everything from Crystal Star to Wraith Squadron to the mess than was the Vong.

Get a good author like Zahn and you get a great villain in a blue skinned manipulator who can hang with the best of them thanks to his tactical ability and his deliberate decision to create his own myths (Hint Thrawn is lying about the art thing). While in some one like Dave Wolverto can write an weird book built on Flash Gordan level silliness (re:The Harpans) but make scene chewing villains like Gethzerion and Warlord Zsinj only for an author like Aaron Allston can turn that same scene chewer of Warlord Zsinj into a very interesting villain.

Then you get the nuttiness of something like Crystal Star
Seriously what the fuck.

[StoneSlinger88]

I miss Qui-Gon.

[Frost]

The Thrawnliness is just about the only thing I recall liking about Star Wars. Well, him and Darth Bane, though that's ruined for me now since I can't even think about him without thinking of him picking up some Jedi motherfucker and breaking him/her over his knee while talking in a bizarre accent. Same reason the movie was ruined for me, because he's fighting Batman the whole goddamn time and I can't help but think the fight would be a lot quicker if he just used his goddamn lightsaber.

I have problems with similar names.

Unrelated:

[Valikdu]

The only ones you can't grab there are proto-Jack and the two best damn characters in the game.

"Disbelieving query: Master, you cannot possibly be suggesting that the aged Jedi meatbag is as good a character as me!"

...

By the way, this story is amazing. Check it out!
Well, after you finish KotOR 1, that is.

[Katarn]

"Proto-Jack"? Who do you mean by that?

Also..KotOR 2 can't start at my work, while KotOR 1 can. (PC at work is powerful..but with integrated video).

[Stringtheory]

Ahoy, there is drama on the internet!
A tumblr post on my dash lead me to a story about a writer for the MLP IDW comics named Ted Anderson added an OC from a tumblr person into one of the comics.
This OC is for a person that goes by "Dragondicks".
This woman is, apparently, a misandrist. She is known for talking about bronies as being a disgusting rape culture bent on perverting a show that's meant to empower little girls into something disgusting and twisted and has put out shirts decrying "literally anything before bros" and "I hate men" with a picture of fluttershy. She appears to be, basically, pretty earnestly extreme.
Ted Anderson is a blatant apologist. Paraphrasing some posts of his, he feels that as a white, educated cis male of the middle class, he's the epitome of privilege. Such that he can't even understand the ways he benefits. He sees things like what Dragondicks does or (and he specifically makes this comparison) when black comedians make fun of white people as a form of rebellion against the injustices they suffer in an unfair world, which is why "reverse racism" and "reverse sexism" "don't exist". I think his point is that hatred is justified against those that benefit from privilege, essentially, and should be respected as a right of those not of privilege.
In the comic in question he had a picture of himself put in the back of the comic wearing one of this woman's misandry shirts and the woman's OC was on a poster in a panel of the comic itself.
A ton of people emailed IDW about their endorsement of an outspoken anti-fandom fanatic and now they have fired Ted Anderson and said he will never work for them again.

Yay drama!

And how's the bears shitting in the woods quotient? (Output's up!)

Legally speaking, did Ted Anderson get this woman's permission to purposefully put her OC in the comic? Because if not, I'm fairly certain she could sue IDW for royalties if she wanted to. (Not sure how the legality of OCs in official canon work exactly)
As for the whole thing in general: *sigh* How blatant was this OC in the comic? You said her OC was on a poster in a panel, was the poster focused on full center or was it off in one corner and what was actually on the poster besides the OC? Also, really? For the back of the comic author picture? Really? The guy was treading a fine line. That it got him fired I can totally see happening. Especially for basically declaring oneself 'anti-fandom' on a work for the fandom in question.

EDIT: Just saw the EQD post about it. I think he should have received a very, very strongly worded warning from the company if he's a good writer and his comics sell. However, the fandom would never have forgiven IDW if they had kept him on, so I guess he had to be fired. Not to mention the topic of potentially influencing young kids with divisive political views, so that could mean pissed off parents if they get wind of this, yeah, it's probably best for IDW to drop him like nuclear waste...

[Guest]

It's the topstory over on EQD. Though that person appears to go under a different name.

[Katarn]

So..did I get it correct: one of authors(writers) of IDW introduced in comic OC of person, who hates bronies, because he was feeling guilty for been 'a white, educated cis male of the middle class'...
...well, I'm not sure, that he got what he deserved, might be cutting his salary or something would be enough, but stringtheory made valid point here. What I don't understand, why being 'a white, educated cis male of the middle class' should be a problem or even privilege and person should feel guilty for it? Did he murdered or robbed someone for that?

[Guest]

@Drama
Sounds like it wasn't as bad as putting a Nazi flag in the background. More like putting in a pony with an 88 cutie mark - a more subtle nod to the Nazis.

[Valikdu]

"Proto-Jack"? Who do you mean by that?

Juhani us voiced by the same actress as Subject Zero in ME2.

Legally speaking, did Ted Anderson get this woman's permission to purposefully put her OC in the comic?

He did. And she is presenting this as a super great victory over teh gross bronies. I'm eager to find out how (or if) her tone changes when Anderson is thrown out on his ass.

Anderson has been vocal with insulting the actual user base of the comic that the company is making, on twitter and forums. Companies have fired people for less.

[Katarn]

"Proto-Jack"? Who do you mean by that?

Juhani us voiced by the same actress as Subject Zero in ME2.

Thanks, didn't know that

Legally speaking, did Ted Anderson get this woman's permission to purposefully put her OC in the comic?

He did. And she is presenting this as a super great victory over teh gross bronies. I'm eager to find out how (or if) her tone changes when Anderson is thrown out on his ass.

If I know some thing about this, it would be 'how bronies oppress those, who do the right thing' or something similar.

[Scienza]

The only ones you can't grab there are proto-Jack and the two best damn characters in the game.

"Disbelieving query: Master, you cannot possibly be suggesting that the aged Jedi meatbag is as good a character as me!"

Recant your heresy! Jolee is a god.

Sorta relevant-ish (It's about RPGs, so close enough):

@TedAnderson
I'm always astounded by this fandom's ability to generate shitstorms. It's large part of the reason why I've kinda stopped following a lot of what goes on outside of the show and the fanfics/artists I enjoy. I don't agree with what he did (I prefer to keep real-world politics distinct from my ponies), nor do I fully agree with the fanbase's hyperbolic reaction (I don't think he should have been fired). It's a lot like whole Derpy thing back in S2, only this time I'm not really emotionally invested.

[Katarn]

You killed Mission? You heartless bastard!
Jolee...eh..didn't liked him much.

Also..now I remember who Vette (or was it Veete?) from ToR reminded me.

[Valikdu]

That's what Vette is about, she was written as an expy of Mission. And she has the same actress.

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