Re: [Official!] Project Horizons Comment Crew Chat thread.

[Frost]

They're comin' back here on the 3rd of May. Assuming I'm not out in the field at that point, I should be able to see 'em.

[Harmony Ltd.]

If you wonder what happens when an unstoppable force meets an immovable object, I recommend you stand on the seaside and just look at the waves crashing on the beach for a little while.

You may not get your answer, but at least you'll be relaxed a bit.

[Harmony Ltd.]

Hey Sci!

I see you've Transistor on your wishlist. FYI, it's 66% off on steam right now.

There's steam sales right now, with some interesting offers. For example, the Borderlands Prequel is 50% off.

[Valikdu]

Yesterday's event in Doomy's interpretation:

Spoiler:

There was also a balloon gun, but Joakim gave it to a little girl along with his shades.

[O. Hinds]

74! This will, I expect, upset many people in varying ways.

[Frost]

Was he doing his signature crowd-pleasing dance move, "aggressively start a chainsaw?", Val?

[RoboRed]

godf$ckingdamnit somber I have papers to write whhyyyyyyyy

[Harmony Ltd.]

What band is that, Val?

[Tytan]

Sabaton I think.

[Scienza]

Hey Sci!

I see you've Transistor on your wishlist. FYI, it's 66% off on steam right now.

There's steam sales right now, with some interesting offers. For example, the Borderlands Prequel is 50% off.

Oooh! Thanks for telling me. I'll see if I can grab it before the sale ends.

[O. Hinds]

So, um. My mother's written a book. People interested in fantasy might enjoy it.
...I'm not very good at writing advertisements. I've also not personally read the book, it not being so much to my tastes, but, knowing her, I am confident in its quality. So... yeah. Check it out, as the saying goes. :)
(Sorry for the awkwardness, but I do want to help her out and do think that people interested in that sort of thing are reasonably likely to enjoy it.)

[Downloaded Skill]

Hey guys so I was thinking about potentially restarting the PHCC game night. There are quite a few new multiplayer games now so we should be able to avoid the TF2 stagnation that plagued it last time. If there is enough interest I'll create a different thread about it.

[Tytan]

@DS, I would recommend Nosgoth. It's a free arena shooter with vampires and vampire hunters.

[Ironmonger]

@DS
I might be up for game night. Today, an IRL friend of mine showed me how to use a controller with non-controller games, so I can actually do some gaming with no strain.

[Ironmonger]

Something for Cobalt.

[Guest]

Something for Cobalt.

Ha! Liked the giant salad fork. I admit, I actually listen to some djent-ish stuff every now and then, but it's pretty telling I think that the band is one dude who plays the drums and everything else is varying degrees of machine. It scratches the electronic music itch I sometimes get.

[Harmony Ltd.]

'Tis be fucking cool!

[Guest]

They're not really false memories though. Seems it's more like false feelings associated with a memory. That is if I'm understanding it right.

[O. Hinds]

Still, very interesting, and I can see the developed technology having a great deal of potential.

[Scienza]

Still, very interesting, and I can see the developed technology having a great deal of potential.

Once this becomes over-the-counter, I am so going back and changing all memories of high school.

[Harmony Ltd.]

Personally, and that would just apply to myself, I'm not a fan of getting false memories of the past implanted into my system.

If it were useful memories pertaining to the acqusition of a skill, then yeah, maybe. But simply changing what I remember of the past for things that didn't actually happen? I have some practical and philosophical reservations against that. Mostly practical ones.

But for people for whom the past holds no positives, I can perfectly understand why they would do so. It just seems like it could be handicapping if you were to interact with people from that time period.

[Katarn]

That's sounds like something from Orwell or similar. I wouldn't want that to exist.

[O. Hinds]

@swicked:
Yes, that's the sort of thing my mind immediately jumped to, too.

As Last pointed out, mind, it, at least at the moment, doesn't seem, at least based on that article, to actually create false memories (yet, at least). It seems to me that there's a lot that can be done just with manipulating the emotions connected to existing memories, though.

That's sounds like something from Orwell or similar. I wouldn't want that to exist.

Hm, not sure about Orwell. 1984, which is what I assume you're referring to, involved attempted thought control, but it didn't actually work very well (at least, I highly doubt it; Airstrip One might have been operating as desired, but given the state of the place, that seems unlikely). I unfortunately still haven't gotten around to reading Brave New World, but this sounds more similar to what I've read of that, if you want to make such comparisons.

Of course, with the technology currently still so immature, it's hard to say what sorts of societies it might be able to support.

@swicked again:
...And yeah, probably time for this quote again:

Swick, half the time you're the only sane one, and the other half, you're the scariest son-of-a-bitch in the thread.

Key factor being how much Hinds is posting, because I'm still fairly confident he's a vengeful ex-Soviet Bloc missile engineer. Or Whiskey, because no one best summed up as "Hillbilly Me" is a man to be trifled with.

[Guest]

Hmmm... yeah.
All in favor of changing the context of past memories, making them less traumatic.
Not for changing them.
...unless this is more of a gateway to sleep-learning. I'd love to be wasting less of my life laying down doing nothing.

What do you mean? I'm not sure I get the distinction. That is changing the memory, is it not?

Practically when talking about this it'd be nice to see people with triggers more common in day to day life (the stereotype of a soldier suffering PTSD for instance is often that they're triggered by loud noises or bangs) to be helped get over them with this kind of treatment if possible. Hopefully of course improving their quality of life overall.

But to have a memory altered or even the feeling associated with that memory altered is absolutely terrifying.

[Frost]

Or you could emplace deep-cover Manchurian-style agents behind enemy lines, ready to spring like a loaded trap when the right trigger shakes them out of their false memories and awakens the weapon within. 

Envision a Mexican Special Operator implanted in an ISIS cell (it'd work 'cause they're both brown) and just when they're about to begin their crusade against the filthy infidels, Abu raises his detonator, and.....

Boom. Fiesta

[Katarn]

Yes...confeetii everywhere...

[Harmony Ltd.]

In the roleplaying game setting "Eclipse Phase", this is actually a real and present concern, as mind upload and memory manipulations are widespread technologies; with that kind of sleeper agents being regularly used against the anti-transhuman faction (The Jovian Junta).

To such a point that anyone wanting to get into their territories (be it by going there physically, or most commonly by uploading their minds into a local body - interplanetary travel isn't cheap) needs to undergo thorough scans of their Ego for possible discrepancies potentially revealing of a sleeper agent; and even then they get branded and cannot participate in a number of activities like government work, law enforcement, military, etc...

While it is shocking denial of basic human rights, it is to be noted that it is often the only thing standing between them and their whole society being sabotaged at every turn.

[Katarn]

What can be with all this 'memory alteration' can be seen in"Remember me" game.

[Scienza]

I am so doing this for any and all future graphics work.

[Guest]

@Memory Modification
Gotta say, I'm kind of a fan of the idea. Not just for relieving PTSD, or the more theoretical sleep-learning/"I know kung fu" skill downloading, but even for the mind-fuckery. People are always lamenting how our justice system fails to reform people, and this could be a possible treatment tool for folks with seriously twisted minds. Sure, it's a bit Clockwork Orange (okay, it's exactly Clockwork Orange), but given that the alternatives are locking them up forever or killing them, I'm not sure that the human rights issue would be as much of a concern at that level. Maybe even for lesser crimes - I mean, what do you call anger management classes and Alcoholics Anonymous if not an attempt at changing the way someone's mind works? We give people antipsychotics and confine them involuntarily if we believe they're a threat to others or themselves - if the tech proves safe and effective on humans, it should be an option. Voluntary, maybe, as an alternative to other systems like the standard "spend years in jail getting indoctrinated into the Aryan Brotherhood, who will teach you important skills you can use once you're on the outside, like how to smuggle heroin in your bum." Not sure people would go for it, though, the mind is pretty sanctified, ya know? Plus, all this is predicated on this kind of thing working on humans and being reasonably safe. And even testing either of those is going to be minefield.

In terms of warfare, imagine if American identity became an idea-virus, spread through the concept that A) You are a loyal American citizen, and B) You should seek out non-Americans and take them to blacksites or safe spots where fellow loyal American citizens can come to turn them into more Americans. The Cult of America. Eventually, the only non-indoctrinated nations are the rare, isolated states who managed to close their borders, and America itself.

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