Fallout Equestria: Project Horizon (Revised Edition)

[Kattlarv]

So, finally got around to making this post. Hopefully at the correct place too.
Anyhow, to get the link to it, look up "dewflower" on tumblr, and search for "project horizons", in case it's too far down to scroll too.
Hopefully it's an okay use of the original index and fic. Heard no objections when I asked at least.

Basically, to give a brief resume, which is also kinda included in the link: the "revised editions" main intent is to add up some variation into PH in terms  of who does what. Mainly, in terms of rapists. It also focus on making some characters more IC, and remove some of the sudden reveals or swaps in personality. No spoiler reveals, but just to avoid a character suddenly ex: exclaiming their love/hate for x, despite never showing this before.
Anyhow, it does also showcase some very minor plot tweaks. (Mainly using fallout ghouls instead of zombies, and BJ being casual about her sexuality, and show notable signs of 99 mentality, so there's quiet a bit more mention of sex in this I guess... least going with the one I've had read it so far. But supposedly it helped liven up things.) Not too sure how they ended up there... really rather "meh" about some of them. But eh... give and take I guess. So yeah, I guess if you planned on reading, or re-reading PH, but wanted a little more diversity, and some parts like Styg to make more sense and less plot conveniences and character personality 180's, then the revised editions could possibly be for you. I'm not the best of writers, but from what I've been told so far, I've done a great job in the  intended areas. And... questionable in the random ones. So, enjoy I guess.

The revised chapters got a"(R)" next to them. I've not done all atm, and is currently on a break to work with a VN. But the first chunk is completed, and just started the second, not finished with the first chapter there either, so keep that in mind.
Think that's all I can think of atm... hopefully managed to upload this correctly. So... yeah.

[Derpmind]

You've put a big amount of work into this, so I'm just gonna say that I haven't looked at nearly enough to make an informed opinion about it. Though you might want to change up the index page a bit; make it a little more obvious that it's not the original. Anyways, for the rest of us: http://text-compare.com/

[Vinylshadow]

Are the downloads for the original Project Horizons, or the Revised version?

[Kattlarv]

Not as much as Somber into the original.
Well, I thought the large "REVISED" might help. Dunno what else to change tbh. It has notice text here and there.


@Vinyl: Considering I've only done the first volume so far, it's the original.

[Vinylshadow]

Well, I've always been meaning to re-read Horizons; might as well read a revised version and see how it goes

Can't promise I'll point out mistakes if I find any; I rarely ever point them out even to myself; I only tend to save passages I find amusing

Best of luck to you in this endeavor

[O. Hinds]

Why did you change the mechanics of ghouls?

[Icy Shake]

Not as much as Somber into the original.
Well, I thought the large "REVISED" might help. Dunno what else to change tbh. It has notice text here and there.

Part of the issue there is that revised editions are things that the original author sometimes puts out on their own (see, for instance, Past Sins). A couple of possibilities to dodge that bullet, if it's a concern, would be "Kattlarv's Revision" or "Kattlarv's Revised Edition."

So, here are some thoughts/observations, based entirely on the first chapter.

It seems like many of the changes involve making explicit things that had been inferable in the original text. I think that this tends to be a detriment, as it adds wordiness without any new information. It also leads in some cases to real changes to meaning or tone that I think are not improvements. For example, in "I looked into his eyes and deliberately toggled two shotgun blasts to the head. It was technically still self-defense. I was security and I was protecting my stable," where you added the word "technically," it altered the tone I perceived from one where Blackjack is engaging in an impulsive psychological defense mechanism because she doesn't want to see herself as a killer to a more conscious, thoughtful one where she's thinking in terms of what is acceptable under rules and regulations.

Similarly, there were one or two places where I think you actively undermined what I understand to be one of your goals: working with the Stable 99 mentality on sex and the sexes. When in "The pistol’s nine millimeter rounds thumped into the mare with abandon; clearly, these psychotic equines were disposable" you changed "mares" to "equines," you're lessening the fact that Blackjack tends to (especially very early on) have a very female-default mindset, in which unless she has a specific reason to think about stallions as well, she only considers mares. Even many chapters on, she specifically thought about having a filly, not a foal, for example, because that was the defining moment when your family started. Colts didn't count.

In this case, "“Male? Pssh... don’t be silly. I’m not sexist, even if that was possible, I don’t discriminate, I just never miss a chance to break anypony...”" where you add "don’t be silly. I’m not sexist, even if that was possible, I don’t discriminate, " you seem to be adding no meaningful and relevant information that wasn't apparent from what was already there, but resulted in clunkier dialog that also raises issues like how Daisy seems to think that sexism, something easily definable and clearly possible (she even knows what it is, saying she doesn't discriminate, which, if it's something she feels she has to say she doesn't do, implies that it's something she could do) is an incoherent concept that couldn't even exist in principle. Which is kind of distracting.

These were some of the examples that most stood out to me, but this sort of thing seemed pretty frequent, if generally with less negative effect. As here, “Well… I guess you won’t tell anypony. Or well, no offense, but not like anypony would believe a buck either...” where you added the second sentence, which (along with the idea that "anypony" doesn't include males, or anything that happens between males alone doesn't matter) is just making subtext explicit. I think you can put faith in the audience that they can pick this stuff up.

A few other quick notes, mostly more on the mechanical side: "feet" is canon measurement, and has been since the end of 2011; it's "PipBuck"; "both" implies exactly two items ("both literally, metaphorically, and every fucking way in between!"--if you want the word "both," you'd have "both literally and metaphorically, and every fucking way in between!"); it's "damn it" or "dammit"; and bear in mind that you're revising a story written in American English, so a lot of ous become just o, and doubled ls are somewhat less common (though "traveling" is still written with two ls in the Commonwealth style), and which uses the Oxford comma.

[Kattlarv]

@Vinyl: Well thanks. Find it to be a kinda ~decently working version. Really only happy with the main edits though. The side stuff is kinda wobbly.

@O.Hinds: Well, mainly to make them fallout ghouls instead of movie zombies. Mainly as Somber apparently didn't know anything about ghouls of what I got told.

@Icy: Well, it says on each chapter, and below the "REVISED" that it's revised by me.

Hum, for the technical part. Can't say I ever saw it like that. Granted, my autistic mind tends to gloss over things like that. To me, it made sense for her to try and rationalize it like that.
The equines part, don't overly recall that one though... but in hindsight, guess she had only met mares up to that point... so guess it makes sense it might feel a little off. Also, you CAN only have fillies in 99. Colts were "removed" from their mothers. So having one wouldn't count.
Guess the Daisy term is a bit sloppy as well. Think my aim there was to have her scoff as the idea a bit that BJ thought she'd only do it because it was a male. The fact BJ supposedly is supposed to care, is due to Sombers description of her, but having Daisy know what sexism is does feel strange when I think of it...

As for the terms overall, I'm not that high on them. But I could try and recall that.
And I know feets are a measuring system, don't see why ponies would have it logically however. Metric system if anything would make more sense. Can try to recall the "PipBuck" though. And dunno about the other stuff, but can try.

[O. Hinds]

@O.Hinds: Well, mainly to make them fallout ghouls instead of movie zombies. Mainly as Somber apparently didn't know anything about ghouls of what I got told.

But what did you find wrong with the way they were?

[Icy Shake]

On only having fillies in 99: that was my point; she still thought that way even long after leaving the stable, and along those same lines, it's often (especially early on) the case that she doesn't think in gender-neutral terms, and not just because Equestria is an inversion of English's historical linguistic default to males.

If you want to stay away from feet (introduced as a measurement in Equestria in "Hearth's Warming Eve"), I'd suggest using yards, which is what Kkat stuck with. The metric system is in use among scientists and engineers, but isn't what typical ponies used (Horse, for instance, hates the classical system as illogical, but Goldenblood likes the non-decimal old way).

[Rayndalf]

Just an idea I had:

Blackjack and co. find a number of incendiary, explosive, poison, electric, and flechette rounds, but after their supply is exhausted (a couple chapters?), no more is ever found, or used by anyone else. 
In the original FoE the only unique ammo type were essentially armor piercing bullets using a bypass spell.
Not really sure how you could improve it though. It is a good scene, but its also just kinda stuck in there. I don't think you want to scatter additional references to ammo types in later chapters, so in all likelihood it will remain.

(The story really is oddly specific about gun stuff early on, naming things with the 'IS-' prefix only to completely drop it.)

I proceeded further into the lab, kicking brass and shotgun hulls with each step.  I had to admit I was glad nopony had made it up here before us.  There was a veritable cornucopia of ammunition up here.  I passed by ammo crates with pistol, revolver, shotgun, and rifle ammunition.  Several of them had markings I’d never seen before: red, orange, green, blue, and black bands.  And here I had a number of sentry robots to try them out on!

Also:

I trotted into the sector’s communal bathroom, and immediately my ears perked to a familiar giggling.  Walking past a stall, (sadly not the one with the glory hole... I still wanted to know who kept making it. It had gotten covered several time, but somehow it always sprung back up, not always the same stall or bathroom, but 99 almost always had one glory hole the more stealthy mares utilized for relief. I needed to know! For... job reasons, yeah, that’s it... I had to catch them and shut down their operation... unless you know, they managed to bribe me or something...) I glanced in at two mares employing unauthorized and probably ineffective washing techniques... one of the mares certainly had something they might need help with washing however... But according to the training manual, behavior like that in public spaces was punishable by whipping and restriction to C class rations, so it was pretty understandable that the pair looked up with some trepidation when they spotted me.

Its like the setup for a porno.

This seems odd. If it was an old glory hole made before the "incident" that was never repaired it might make more sense. Is the inference that someone will use their tongue? If they could share a stall why make the hole in the first place? 
Sarcastically speaking I would call this immersion breaking.

Edit:

The caliber was huge; almost as big as my horn! Well... not that it was the biggest horn but... it was still bigger than a regular bullet! It seemed as if the pistol had been armored.  It loaded from a breech like a break-action shotgun, but clearly it’d been engineered for precision.

IIRC We later catch Blackjack describing her horn as being the size of a shotgun shell, but she stops before she tells us which gauge. 

  I got to one door and immediately froze.  I could feel the tingle in my skin even before I could hear the clicking of the PipBuck on my foreleg.  Whatever was behind the locked door, I could live with the mystery. I wasn’t that eager to grow a third vagina.

 Are you implying that she already was two?

[Vinylshadow]

I keep telling myself that if I'm caught looking at horse anatomy I'll have a very awkward time explaining why...

I'm still stuck on:

I bet her family jewel matched the size of the rest of it... she made it hard for me to get a good look at it. Only ever managed to seen her flaccid length in the showers.But I bet she was mottled inside...

Flaccid length? Either my female anatomy is out of date or is Midnight part-stallion?
Or I don't know horses...


Also, should be 'see' instead of 'seen'

[Guest]

As a mod you're judgement is what really matters but I would like to mention that it was only a couple chapters ago that BJ literally sucks cum off of her lips. I haven't read this version of the story (and don't really plan to) so I have no idea what you mean by iffy but that scene seemed iffy to me.

[Rayndalf]

It would be easier just to remove the instance(s) of iffiness and keep the link, as the instance(s) iffiness adds little value to the story.

[Rayndalf]

Sorry about that, I was suggesting that Kattlarv removed the questionable sentences herself, and allow the link to remain, though my previous statement appears almost comically vague...

[Kattlarv]

@O.Hinds: Well, mainly to make them fallout ghouls instead of movie zombies. Mainly as Somber apparently didn't know anything about ghouls of what I got told.

But what did you find wrong with the way they were?

Eh... just not that big fan of movie zombies in a fallout setting. I like the fallout ghouls.

@Icy Shake: I know, but that's how Somber sees her, and I tried my best to make that notable.

And I know it was introduced. But eh... it's literally just the US, and... 2-3 other places that use that.

@Rayndalf: Hum, noticed the error in that first chunk. Prolly derp on my part... or, I think it might be they were there before. As in, it was a munition production room?

Hey, the main scene was there before I even touched this. All I did to it was include the glory hole xP Dunno, just wanted my own running gag. I mean, almost anything beats the failed Styg one xD
Anyhow, why would it make more sense if before the incident? Because there'd be more ponies and not as tightly monitored? BJ mentions somepony keeps making a new one if maintenance plugs the old one. Sides, there's only mares out there now so, why wouldn't they have one? xP If it was done before that only meant they're missing out on guys working them too xP Mares are the only gender than can be serviced properly through them anyhow xD And prolly as you don't have overly much room in one stall? And mostly as it's just a fetish object. And kinks being a thing that defines 99... so yeah. I wanted a running gag, this fit the semi-perverse fetish category 99 was keen on having.

As for the size: Eh, as said: was a large caliber. They can be the length of a shell. She doesn't mention what caliber it is either.

As for the vag part: No, but another pun. As, come on: Misery doesn't come alone :P
If she'd get fucked over by taint or something, it wouldn't just mess her up in one way xP

@Vinyl: ... okay, this part I can admit to fully being my "fault" xD I don't recall if Somber ever refers to what design they got. But eh, sorta second nature to be to go for... "realism" so to say.

And no, that would just be me taking liberal use of accurate anatomy. I only ever use terms that actually work if applied to the gender I use it on. In this case, "length" refers to the slit of the vulva, from top to bottom, aka: a length. And females can be erect and flaccid, goes for horses too. Male erectile tissue looks like like "ll" while female is "Y" shaped. One is the internal and external part of the clit, ~70 % male length. And the other two go down along the mound/lips, making the whole area darken and swell up. So yes, you can see a chick flaccid. It's actually easy to tell, if you know what to look for. (aside slickness)

@Swicked: Nope, it doesn't go blatant clop. It sticks to PH standards to all I recall of what I've read. BJ does trail off a bit more thinking about sex though. But no, it does never directly go into "classic clopfic" mode.
And excuse me, but I can't manage to check this site daily anymore.
And come on! I asked three times in the main thread, only got "probably/most likely" and "sure" as replies. If you'd had an objection or inquiry, you could have asked then. And how is my questionable stuff worse than graphically describing rape/mutilation sex? PH has a bunch* of clop in it. What makes mine worse?
... okay, quick mind scan wise, I can think of one thing I've included that PH hadn't: described climax, as BJ does barge in, into her room just as she gets off. So okay fine, it has that. Not really cloppy imo though. But it's literally just described a bit differently thanl the scenes where a male cums inside of BJ, and she described it filling her. Is it because it starts so early? As you can't deny PH has excessive squick.

[Rayndalf]

@Rayndalf: Hum, noticed the error in that first chunk. Prolly derp on my part... or, I think it might be they were there before. As in, it was a munition production room?

Hey, the main scene was there before I even touched this. All I did to it was include the glory hole xP Dunno, just wanted my own running gag. I mean, almost anything beats the failed Styg one xD
Anyhow, why would it make more sense if before the incident? Because there'd be more ponies and not as tightly monitored? BJ mentions somepony keeps making a new one if maintenance plugs the old one. Sides, there's only mares out there now so, why wouldn't they have one? xP If it was done before that only meant they're missing out on guys working them too xP Mares are the only gender than can be serviced properly through them anyhow xD And prolly as you don't have overly much room in one stall? And mostly as it's just a fetish object. And kinks being a thing that defines 99... so yeah. I wanted a running gag, this fit the semi-perverse fetish category 99 was keen on having.

As for the size: Eh, as said: was a large caliber. They can be the length of a shell. She doesn't mention what caliber it is either.

As for the vag part: No, but another pun. As, come on: Misery doesn't come alone :P
If she'd get fucked over by taint or something, it wouldn't just mess her up in one way xP

Now I'm suggesting that you watch porn or anything... but Wikipedia is there for you.
Am I correct in the assumption that glory holes require a penis to work?

[Kattlarv]

@Rayndalf: Hum, noticed the error in that first chunk. Prolly derp on my part... or, I think it might be they were there before. As in, it was a munition production room?

Hey, the main scene was there before I even touched this. All I did to it was include the glory hole xP Dunno, just wanted my own running gag. I mean, almost anything beats the failed Styg one xD
Anyhow, why would it make more sense if before the incident? Because there'd be more ponies and not as tightly monitored? BJ mentions somepony keeps making a new one if maintenance plugs the old one. Sides, there's only mares out there now so, why wouldn't they have one? xP If it was done before that only meant they're missing out on guys working them too xP Mares are the only gender than can be serviced properly through them anyhow xD And prolly as you don't have overly much room in one stall? And mostly as it's just a fetish object. And kinks being a thing that defines 99... so yeah. I wanted a running gag, this fit the semi-perverse fetish category 99 was keen on having.

As for the size: Eh, as said: was a large caliber. They can be the length of a shell. She doesn't mention what caliber it is either.

As for the vag part: No, but another pun. As, come on: Misery doesn't come alone :P
If she'd get fucked over by taint or something, it wouldn't just mess her up in one way xP

Now I'm suggesting that you watch porn or anything... but Wikipedia is there for you.
Am I correct in the assumption that glory holes require a penis to work?

You meant to say "I'm not suggesting"?
And nope. You're thinking of human glory holes. These are equine.

[Rayndalf]

@Rayndalf: Hum, noticed the error in that first chunk. Prolly derp on my part... or, I think it might be they were there before. As in, it was a munition production room?

Hey, the main scene was there before I even touched this. All I did to it was include the glory hole xP Dunno, just wanted my own running gag. I mean, almost anything beats the failed Styg one xD
Anyhow, why would it make more sense if before the incident? Because there'd be more ponies and not as tightly monitored? BJ mentions somepony keeps making a new one if maintenance plugs the old one. Sides, there's only mares out there now so, why wouldn't they have one? xP If it was done before that only meant they're missing out on guys working them too xP Mares are the only gender than can be serviced properly through them anyhow xD And prolly as you don't have overly much room in one stall? And mostly as it's just a fetish object. And kinks being a thing that defines 99... so yeah. I wanted a running gag, this fit the semi-perverse fetish category 99 was keen on having.

As for the size: Eh, as said: was a large caliber. They can be the length of a shell. She doesn't mention what caliber it is either.

As for the vag part: No, but another pun. As, come on: Misery doesn't come alone :P
If she'd get fucked over by taint or something, it wouldn't just mess her up in one way xP

Now I'm suggesting that you watch porn or anything... but Wikipedia is there for you.
Am I correct in the assumption that glory holes require a penis to work?

You meant to say "I'm not suggesting"?
And nope. You're thinking of human glory holes. These are equine.

"Not that I'm" would have been the intended phrase 
...Honestly didn't know there were different types, but I also don't think I'm the only one.

[Kattlarv]

Cross-linking due to... rules or something, was never specified.

...I did specify, though. But I can re-specify.
It is against the rules:
https://cloudsville.rpg-board.net/t1-rules-for-the-forum
"No posting or linking to overtly sexual or pornographic content."
Descriptions of genitals and of various liquids leaking out of them counts, in my opinion.

I would prefer if you did not link to something that links to something that hosts your stuff. I'd rather you just say "Anyhow, to get the link to it, look up "dewflower" on tumblr."
...so that's what I'm editing your post to say.

So... again: why is the original PH allowed to be linked and posted here then? It has descriptions of genitals, along with mention of various fluids going in and out of several orifices. Not to be picky, but not a fan of slipping favors/special treatment. As said: is it because it originally came as a surprise a while into PH? Or because it was sperm being mentioned being shot/oozing out?

And last time THAT'S how we were told to cross link. We could link to something that links to the source. It's how we've done in the chat thread most times before. Plus, just "looking up" could lead to having to delve through a lot of unwanted stuff. Not to sound like that, but you're making it very inconvenient for people to access it. Really, if you could just tell what specific point it "crosses over" to not be allowed to be linked, compared to all the similar scenes in original PH, I could just tone those down to PH levels of explicit.


@Rayndalf: Allright, then it does make sense :P
And I technically seem to have invented the equine version, so that might have something to do about it... but basically: picture human anatomy. Think of how we generally utilize glory holes and urinals. Now picture equine anatomy, and picture how they would generally utilize glory holes and urinals. There's a quite sharp role reversal of what gender can use them efficiently.

[Kattlarv]

So, as it's obviously needed: Once I get going again, (most projects wrapped up by now) and technically prior "recap" wise, anyone got interest to proofread this?
As feedback so far, it has nice improvements, but as said: also slip ups, or parts that plainly don't go over as well, or that'd need some polish to go over at all.

[MiniGaunt]

@Kattlarv: I would proof read if you are looking for someone. Also thanks for making the thread that made me come out of lurker status!
On the topic of feedback, I enjoy how it is going so far, adding a depth that would be too time consuming for Somber to do while writing new chapters, so the Revised edition adds more background to things I didn't know needed it. (That is a good thing) Continuity will be your downfall if you aren't prepared to spend a long time, hopefully with proofreaders, that will be fixed.

[Kattlarv]

@Kattlarv: I would proof read if you are looking for someone. Also thanks for making the thread that made me come out of lurker status!
On the topic of feedback, I enjoy how it is going so far, adding a depth that would be too time consuming for Somber to do while writing new chapters, so the Revised edition adds more background to things I didn't know needed it. (That is a good thing) Continuity will be your downfall if you aren't prepared to spend a long time, hopefully with proofreaders, that will be fixed.

Would be appreciated. And you're welcome I guess xP
And yeah, so far, overall feedback wise, I've been told it adds needed depth, explanation/reason and whatnot to things, but also that I make some slip-ups, that hamper, or otherwise too poorly explain something that would be a great improvement, if I only had formulated it better. And so far, I've had no continuity issues whatsoever. Did a minor plot chance, but it was easy enough to keep in mind. But yeah, Somber has stated they have no interest in fixing up the fic of any plot, character or continuity issues. It's a reminder to them that "they can do better". Atop that it's been going on for to long and they just want it finished. So a revised edition was imo the best solution to fix the mistakes, while letting the original stand as it is.

Would honestly not have minded to fix the main stupid issues in the original FoE, but eh... dunno, just feels more tricky. Atop getting ahold of Kkat I mean, very asocial person.

[Kattlarv]

Welp, revised another chapter. Expected to have more time to these tbh... not even reached the main parts I want to revise atm xD
Would be faster to just fix the few like, two blatant errors (or well, "plot convenience" and illogicality) in the orignal FoE heh. But dunno, there's just something too boring looming over that.

And would be a fix that'd be better suited to just correct the original version with. But know Kkat is too [insert fitting descriptor here] for that. So eh xP Can't blame em too much. They got about the same approach I got when it comes to fixing old things x3 Just cba most the time. Though, we differ quite a bit when it comes to making sure somethings finished at least. Trailing off here heh.

Either case, going off topic here.
But yeah, another chapter is revamped. And do have to say: While breezing through most of the diversifying. The other random changes I make for... not 100 % sure why, but those I could really go with proofreading. Like pointed out before in this thread. That, or just leave it and only do the diversity changes... but eh, it's too late for that. Already far in on it.

[Kattlarv]

Welp, while at a halt, I went and did my main two scene goals for this at least, the rape scene, and the consensual rape scene.
Not sure how they turned out, but eh. Hopefully they went ok.

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