Apologies for the 'guerrilla warfare' pun

[Meleagridis]

I wish I could reply to more, but I have to go.

Rose Radio:

With this, I'm leaning more to Radio Moojave run by a single voice with a passion for entertainment rather than by two. So I'm wondering how that meeting would go, exactly. Rose tracks down the source of the two voices on the radio and finds a single pony poser. Could be interesting. But so long as Rose (or her representative) remains friendly, the DJ would certainly be swayed by the promise of new material for her listeners.
By the way, I think I know how it might be broadcast. A stationary station in a hideaway in the mountains would be playing loops of music and whatever pre-war entertainment Stridula can find. Now when Homage was on the run, how did she get the news out and onto the radio again? Was it the SPP towers? Is there some feature that can be added to the Moojave that would allow the DJ to get the nitty gritty details on the ground and share them on the go, perhaps broadcast equipment in the Moover Line? Communications towers? Then she could sneak in and make the announcement without having to fly all the way back home.

Interesting. I'm wondering how the Cow Guai would interact with the Rose Banner. On the one hand, the Banner, to try and increase recruitment, governs brahmin by the same rules as it governs ponies. On the other, since they have no problem using pony slaves, they still have no problem using brahmin slaves, and they moreover, to try and build support, will often answer requests from the locals for Banner soldiers providing protection. While, to avoid upsetting the bovine population of the area, aid to locals treating brahmin as animals or racially slaves is somewhat avoided, but the practice is too common for the Banner to altogether avoid aiding practitioners.

The problem here is that I'm still working before Rose's approach, or even Red-Eye's fall. We'd need to determine what happened to the players in the Moojave after the inevitable Chosen One or Stable Dweller or Lone Wanderer traipses through and touches everyone's stuff. By the time Rose rolls around, the Cow brothers will be venerable and their situations will have changed. By this time Papa Cow might have had a break-through that rallies even the Guai to his cause, or he might have finally pushed his brother too far and been wiped out. On the other hoof, Papa Guai might have gotten himself assassinated or pushed his troops past the brink of survival. Or it could still be precisely the same. Or hell, maybe the time and/or protagonist influence is what split them up in the first place. I'm... not sure.

But if the Cow Guai were largely unaltered by the time Rose rolls around, it would not be pretty. Papa Guai doesn't tolerate slavery in any form- even of ponies, though he feels they brought it on themselves. He would have to decide whether to recall nearly every Guai in the Moojave to try and repel the intrusion, or to try and keep the problems he already has from spiraling out of control. It would be a tough decision- he's smart enough to know that if the Banner takes a foothold they are likely here to stay, but taking enough troops to wage war would mean letting slavers and mad cows run rampant throughout the Moojave. Their brutality makes the Cow Guai unpopular, but effective in their ultimately altruistic goals.

In the end I'm pretty sure he would focus on the Moojave, and just try to imagine that the other side of the river is beyond his territory. He would certainly do his best to make life a living hell for any Banner forces on the other side of the river with mooerilla warfare.

I read "dock" literally at first; half of me was confused while the other half was running ahead and starting to work on their watercraft and routes. :)

Anyway, that ought to be available. As a minus, it's very static, letting enemies know where to find the Guai. As a plus, of course, it's a fortress. I'm not sure if Moover East's reactor is still functional, though. Oh, and it might be possible to have a tunnel connecting to caves in the mountains. Not sure, but it would help the Guai come and go unmolested.

Oh, and any thoughts on the name "Westside" for the pony town in Moover Line West? It's the best that I've been able to come up with so far.

That makes it even more ideal a fortress for me! I had this idea about ending something with a chase through the mountains and... anyways, that generator problem would be a nice touch. Highlights the fact that the Guai have all the brutes and none of the brain.

But let's say there was broadcasting equipment in the base, and a certain DJ would be willing to provide power to the whole thing in exchange for the use of such equipment. She'd even throw in a little bit of good publicity for a gang that desperately needs it...

Littlehorn's location:

So this depends more on what's in the area than anything. If there are going to be many ruins or whatnot, then it's not an ideal place for Littlehorn. Unless it's placement is particularly remote.

___

So... any good place you can think of to put an Honest Hearts style idyllic chunk of nature, spoiled and desiccated by a sudden influx of Pink Cloud?

[Harmony Ltd.]

RE flag for the NCR...

Here's a random idea :




Before I explain the meaning I put behind it, what does that inspire you ?

[Harmony Ltd.]

How about that ?

[Harmony Ltd.]

Any resemblance with existing flag(s) is, of course, purely fortuitous.

[O. Hinds]

But anyway, the real motivation to settle the place would be simply to claim the territory and make sure that no one else occupy it (raiders or Miliozi colonists). It will probably never be densely populated.

Ooh, good point; I'm not sure how much of that area the Miliozi claimed in the rush after the official fall of the GPE.

Basically, she's going to be a pain in the ass. As she's always been, and always will be.

:D
It's wise in the Moojave, at least, though. Followers (though not necessarily former Followers) still wouldn't be allowed in lands directly controlled by the Banner, due to the LittlePip connection, but outside those areas they might even be able to get Banner protection (so long as they're careful about how and if they mention the L-word… and if they're not, the Banner protection has none of the qualms about reporting to Rose Eye that the Followers have about reporting to LittlePip). Rose Eye considers the Followers to have Littlepipite leadership (less than most, but still enough) and many Littlepipite members, but she's aware that many other Followers just want to help people; this results in a policy of limited tolerance.

It's an interesting quirk of Rose Eye's brand of hatred; given how authoritarian the NCR's turned out (she approves of that), there's a not bad chance that she'd apply for Banner membership… if the NCR would just publicly denounce LittlePip and sever all friendly ties with her. So yeah, not likely.

The Gardens are Equestria's insurance that even if another war were to happen, even if the land were to be completely torn apart, there would remain hope to rebuild and thrive again. And that's what would make it as much of a target as Celestia One, or even greater than it, in case of war.

Hm… maybe, but the Alliance, for example, probably wouldn't bother targeting Gardens at all. Not unless the NCR had gone all the way through building/refurbishing Stables and the like in preparation for another apocalypse, and even then the Alliance might respond by building its own defenses (Fluttershy did originally intend the PR to use megaspell technology for shields, after all, and Profectum's prototype certainly worked, given how much it was hit with and how not-a-glowing-crater it is). Unless you're proposing that Gardens be used in reverse, a massive scorched earth system as a final deterrent to conquest, Gardens in a big war only becomes important strategic if/after both sides have blasted themselves to bits.

You also have to remember the Goddess entertained the thought of using it to turn Equestria into a complete radioactive hellhole for her Alicorns to thrive. If she thought it possible... Who knows what could happen if an hostile power took control over the place.

Right, that's what I thought of above… I'd recommend just disabling the system (which, given that it requires the living Elements of Harmony to function, ought to be very simple; I don't think that the Goddess knew that), but that could cause problems in the event of a surprise apocalypse. I'd also say that such a thing was unlikely, though.

For these reasons and others I haven't thought of yet, control and protection of the Gardens would be of paramount importance to any power pretending to reign over the equestrian peninsula - not just the NCR, but the Alliance as well if it were to takeover.

It is hard to overstate the strategic importance of the place.

Again, sorry, but I'm just not seeing how. Use it to prevent the land from being poisoned? Well, that will make it more difficult for an enemy to subdue the population through massive casualties, but it also means that they can toss as many balefire bombs and whatnot as they like without being too worried about destroying the land that they're trying to take. Use it for the reverse, to poison Equestria yourself and deny it to an enemy? Assuming that you can even modify it into that, you've just destroyed the thing that you were trying to save, and it still might not stop the enemy if they wanted, say, the mineral resources rather than the biological. Try to use it at all in a surprise attack? All the enemy has to do is kill one of the six Elements to have a pretty good chance of disabling the thing for a while.

Of course there's the issue that Geneighva is just south of Freidrichshorfen

Ooh, I'd forgotten that. :D
Hm, since Stable City is itself isolationist, the Remnants and they might grudgingly trade, a sort of "You want to be left alone, we want to be left alone, so let's trade with each other, if we have to trade with anyone, to make sure that we don't have to trade with people who don't want to leave us alone" thing. Unless/until, of course, Stable City allies/joins the NCR, which is both expansionist and has a grudge against the Remnants…

I'm also wondering if the Remnants would get in contact and work with the Philomenans. They've got some commonalities, and they Alliance would provide transport (Just because the Remnant diplomats could pay, of course, and totally not because the Alliance is trying to put up barriers to the NCR's expansion. The Remnant finding out about the Philomenans in the first place also totally had nothing to do with the Alliance, nope.).

Okay, to be honest it's probably more along the lines :

72 % ponies (of which 37% Earth Ponies, 33% Unicorns, 28% Pegasi, 2% Alicorns)
15% Griffins
8% Zebra
5% Miscellaneous

The idea being that there WAS already a good number of zebra roaming around in the Equestrian Wasteland, and that once news propagated in the wider wasteland of Glyphmark's foundation there was an influx of new zebra.

That and natality. And given the zebra are pretty much the doctors of the NCR, they also have the best health and lowest infantile mortality, which bolster their demographic growth.

(but honestly, that was just a random estimation.)

As for why there's so much griffins ? I'll say : the wonders of oviparous reproduction when applied to a civilized society.

Hm… Aye, those seem to make sense.

There's the Ponyville Reservation, and I suppose it wouldn't be hard to convince 50-70 Hellhounds to help if there's enough bits attached to it. It will probably pay more than a dozen expeditions in the Everfree to find plants for Glyphmark's pharma industry.

If there's enough bits, aye. Though the NCR would need to make sure that they got the contracts before the hellhound labor was bought up by mysteriously well-funded Porcans. (And yes, I am rather enjoying your "The Alliance secretly supports groups resisting NCR annexation" idea. It may not be able to directly support the Banner (though it may pay Banner/Moojave Union tolls if those organizations exist when the Alliance gets the rail line for the Moojave to Gibhalter back online) without angering the NCR, but it can make things easier for them.)

With this, I'm leaning more to Radio Moojave run by a single voice with a passion for entertainment rather than by two. So I'm wondering how that meeting would go, exactly. Rose tracks down the source of the two voices on the radio and finds a single pony poser. Could be interesting. But so long as Rose (or her representative) remains friendly, the DJ would certainly be swayed by the promise of new material for her listeners.

I'm a bit confused regarding what you mean here. I was thinking (and, I though, describing) Rose Radio as being a separate station (maybe with multiple channels, later, if the amount of non-music content gets high enough) broadcast from Thornbush and run by Banner members, the DJ probably originally one of the foals from Fillydelphia. Competition, if any, would be friendly (and there might indeed be some trading of material), but they wouldn't be the same station.

Also, when you say "a single voice", I assume you actually mean "two voices, but both belonging to the same person"?

By the way, I think I know how it might be broadcast. A stationary station in a hideaway in the mountains would be playing loops of music and whatever pre-war entertainment Stridula can find. Now when Homage was on the run, how did she get the news out and onto the radio again? Was it the SPP towers? Is there some feature that can be added to the Moojave that would allow the DJ to get the nitty gritty details on the ground and share them on the go, perhaps broadcast equipment in the Moover Line? Communications towers? Then she could sneak in and make the announcement without having to fly all the way back home.

I recall Homage using the SPP towers still, yeah.

Regarding Stridula getting the news, I seem to recall that the Big 52's radio station (I forget the name; I never actually finished Pink Eyes) used actual people on the ground with two-way radios calling in; Pink Eyes isn't part of my headcanon, but perhaps Radio Moojave could use something like that.

Regarding broadcast location, well, Moover West and Moover East probably had the same equipment as Moover South. If that-- Oh, hang on, I misread. You're saying that Stridula gathers her own news (in disguise, of course, not that that's difficult), relays her words to the Radio Moojave broadcast location, and sends them out from there? Hm… Yes, it could be difficult… I don't seem to have any ideas at the moment. In range of Westside (still no feedback on that name, by the way) or possible Moover East, she might be able to set up relays, but out of range… Hm. Also, how would her mountain hideaway have enough power to broadcast a signal across the entire Moojave? The altitude would help, of course, but the mountains might also get in the way… again, hm…

The problem here is that I'm still working before Rose's approach, or even Red-Eye's fall. We'd need to determine what happened to the players in the Moojave after the inevitable Chosen One or Stable Dweller or Lone Wanderer traipses through and touches everyone's stuff. By the time Rose rolls around, the Cow brothers will be venerable and their situations will have changed. By this time Papa Cow might have had a break-through that rallies even the Guai to his cause, or he might have finally pushed his brother too far and been wiped out. On the other hoof, Papa Guai might have gotten himself assassinated or pushed his troops past the brink of survival. Or it could still be precisely the same. Or hell, maybe the time and/or protagonist influence is what split them up in the first place. I'm... not sure.

On the one hand, I'm saddened that my headcanon can't right now be as complete. On the other: yay, even more headcanon! :)

I've been pondering what Stable(s) to put in the Moojave, by the way. I'm so far thinking of one out in the middle of the desert, next to APE's headquarters (which I'm also still pondering putting in the Moojave), but I'm not sure what to make the number or experiment. Also, it was supposed to be unusual that Stable 2 stayed closed for so long (and 99 wasn't actually given any instructions about how long to stay closed), so, if we wanted a Stable dweller (as opposed to the Stable Dweller, of course), we'd have to work that in.

But if the Cow Guai were largely unaltered by the time Rose rolls around, it would not be pretty. Papa Guai doesn't tolerate slavery in any form- even of ponies, though he feels they brought it on themselves. He would have to decide whether to recall nearly every Guai in the Moojave to try and repel the intrusion, or to try and keep the problems he already has from spiraling out of control. It would be a tough decision- he's smart enough to know that if the Banner takes a foothold they are likely here to stay, but taking enough troops to wage war would mean letting slavers and mad cows run rampant throughout the Moojave. Their brutality makes the Cow Guai unpopular, but effective in their ultimately altruistic goals.

In the end I'm pretty sure he would focus on the Moojave, and just try to imagine that the other side of the river is beyond his territory. He would certainly do his best to make life a living hell for any Banner forces on the other side of the river with mooerilla warfare.

Ah, quite interesting. It would also, if the Guai were still extant, make Banner protection less of a good thing. One the one hand, they're there to fight off anyone attacking you, like the Guai. On the other, them being there is an inducement for the Guai to attack you.

In the end I'm pretty sure he would focus on the Moojave, and just try to imagine that the other side of the river is beyond his territory. He would certainly do his best to make life a living hell for any Banner forces on the other side of the river with mooerilla warfare.

Do you mean that he'd leave the south bank alone and wage mooerilla warfare (:D) against the Banner on the north bank or that he'd send mooerillas over? You used "the other side of the river" twice, and I'm not sure whether the second time meant the same thing as the first time or whether it meant "The other side from the point of view of the side that the first use of the phrase moved the point of view to".

That makes it even more ideal a fortress for me! I had this idea about ending something with a chase through the mountains and... anyways, that generator problem would be a nice touch. Highlights the fact that the Guai have all the brutes and none of the brain.

But let's say there was broadcasting equipment in the base, and a certain DJ would be willing to provide power to the whole thing in exchange for the use of such equipment. She'd even throw in a little bit of good publicity for a gang that desperately needs it...

Nice! And that solves at least some of my concerns from earlier (ie, how does she power the broadcast). There's still the news relaying problem, though… a PipBuck broadcaster sending to the Encowmpment can only work for so far. The Encompment tower probably has a pretty clear view north, though, which ought to help.

Of course, this also puts the Encowmpment pretty close to Westside, which is not likely to be a terribly amiable neighborship…

So this depends more on what's in the area than anything. If there are going to be many ruins or whatnot, then it's not an ideal place for Littlehorn. Unless it's placement is particularly remote.

___

So... any good place you can think of to put an Honest Hearts style idyllic chunk of nature, spoiled and desiccated by a sudden influx of Pink Cloud?

Well, the thing is, that stuff about Littlehorn being remote? That was before the war even started (truly pre-war). The Moover Line wasn't even a twinkle in an architect's eye yet; the population of that area probably consisted of less than ten ponies running the bridge, a few more to the east running the canals (along with zebras, since it was still a cooperative effort at the time). And after Littlehorn the event, well… would you want to build there? Crescent Moon Canyon was pretty much abandoned before the Ministries had fully formed. And as for being idyllic nature? It's on the edge of Equestria, in a mountain valley with active water flow, and nowhere near much of anything at all. Far away from any megaspell hits.

How about that ?

Hm… I'd say use six six-pointed stars in the arc instead of five five-pointed ones and change the center star to a circle.

[O. Hinds]

Inspired by you, Harmony Ltd., I've tried yet again to make a flag for the Alliance. What do you think of this for the pre-NCR-inclusion flag

and this for for the post-NCR-inclusion flag

? I feel a bit bad for the minor powers, since the representation is pretty much just for the big two/three.

While we're on the subject of flags, I've posted this before, but here's my flag for the Pax Roamana:


Oh, and the Rose Banner's flag is... a red banner with a black line drawing of a rose flower on it. A total surprise, I know.

Also, I realize it's quite early, but...

Potential flag of the potential Moojave Union?:

[O. Hinds]

Also, any thoughts, anyone, on national anthems for any of these parties? The Pax Roaman has Ohe Zebrae and the Miliozi their unnamed (that is, it probably has a name, but I don't know it) song to the tune of the Marcia Reale, but I'm not sure what to use for the Alliance or NCR. The Banner might also have an anthem.
(I think that, given the nationality of a certain major poster in this thread, it would be fun to use La Marseillaise somewhere. :D)

[O. Hinds]

By the way, how old is Stridula?

[Harmony Ltd.]

Hm… I'd say use six six-pointed stars in the arc instead of five five-pointed ones and change the center star to a circle.

What's the symbolism behind your idea ?

Because here the stars represent the Elements of Harmony : Magic / Friendship surrounded by the virtues of Generosity, Honesty, Kindness, Positivity / Laughter and Loyalty.

[O. Hinds]

Hm… I'd say use six six-pointed stars in the arc instead of five five-pointed ones and change the center star to a circle.

What's the symbolism behind your idea ?

Because here the stars represent the Elements of Harmony : Magic / Friendship surrounded by the virtues of Generosity, Honesty, Kindness, Positivity / Laughter and Loyalty.

That's roughly the symbolism behind mine; I don't think that this version is quite right. Currently, the favored candidate for Magic is Life Bloom; it might be someone else, but, even so, it seems unlikely that they'd be pivotal to the others (important, yes, something to orbit, no). In my version, the six stars in the arc are the elements (they're six-pointed because six, to me, is a more significant number in Equestrian culture than five is) while the yellow circle represents, through representing the sun, the Lightbringer who brought the Elements together.

[Harmony Ltd.]

I could see it...

I'll see what kind of design I can come up with this evening.


Just a thing though :

A direct reference to Littlepip on the NCR's very flag. How's that for Rose Eye ?

[O. Hinds]

I could see it...

I'll see what kind of design I can come up with this evening.


Just a thing though :

A direct reference to Littlepip on the NCR's very flag. How's that for Rose Eye ?

:D
Well, you did spark it by referencing the Elements...

[O. Hinds]

I actually turned my computer back on to post this. For the national anthem of Equestria, at least from the start of the show to end of the war...
What about this? :D
It's happy, optimistic, includes Equestria's speciesism, and would be so deliciously ironic (just imagine, as the green snow starts to fall, a failing computer somewhere reaching that on a radio playlist and glitchy descending into dead static on "to the very end").

I'm not sure about the flag, though. The flag in that episode (here's a better view) might be a modern flag (meaning, at least according to my headcanon, the flag of the Diararchy), and I think that the Diarachy flag was still used through Luna's monarchial reign until the end of the war. On the other hoof, that might be a Goddesses flag, from the period between the first defeat of Discord and the Nightmare Moon affair (that's about two centuries, though, and they might not have used the same flag for the entire time). It's not the flag of the original Equestria, in any case, but I put that down to the prop department's limited supplies/knowledge of vexillology.

[Harmony Ltd.]

After a bit of reflection, I think these population numbers would make a bit more sense :

Code:

Total population : around 450,000

75 % Ponies (37% Earth Ponies, 35% Unicorns, 26% Pegasi, 2% Alicorns)
12% Griffins
8% Zebra
5% Miscellaneous (mostly ghouls)

I'd have to come up with numbers for the individual states and major cities of the NCR to have a better idea.

Ooh, I'd forgotten that. :D
Hm, since Stable City is itself isolationist, the Remnants and they might grudgingly trade, a sort of "You want to be left alone, we want to be left alone, so let's trade with each other, if we have to trade with anyone, to make sure that we don't have to trade with people who don't want to leave us alone" thing. Unless/until, of course, Stable City allies/joins the NCR, which is both expansionist and has a grudge against the Remnants…

I'm also wondering if the Remnants would get in contact and work with the Philomenans. They've got some commonalities, and they Alliance would provide transport (Just because the Remnant diplomats could pay, of course, and totally not because the Alliance is trying to put up barriers to the NCR's expansion. The Remnant finding out about the Philomenans in the first place also totally had nothing to do with the Alliance, nope.).

Stable City's brand of isolationism is special in the sense that it simply lacks interest in expanding : it has all the comfort it can ask for thanks to all the Stable-Tec gadgets it has at its disposal, and accommodating population growth is as simple as expanding the underground cities and the life-support systems (which thanks to all the fine tooling equipment the Ghouls and the Guardians have is a trivial matter given all the resources which can be scavenged on the surface). And it isn't as much isolationist as it is isolated, geographically speaking, in a dead-end in the middle of the mountains.

Of course, having been isolated for so long with only reduced contacts with the rest of the Wasteland (the occasional caravan) for two centuries will influence their view of the situation. But the "isolationism" itself is less a matter of "leave us alone" than "we have always been left alone and we were okay with that".

As far as the relations between the NCR and the Enclave Remnants go... don't forget the NCR donate / trade at a loss huge amounts of food with the Remnants (as a way to maintain the peace and preemptively counter any possible rhetoric from the Enclave about the surfacers starving them). The real grudge would go against the Bitters, and it has already been consummated during the War and the "reeducation and reintegration" of the Biters who were made prisonner of war or surrendered. Also, it's important to remember that roughly a third of the NCR pony population (something like a fourth of its total population ?) would have grown up in the Enclave or be descended from people who grew up there. So it would predispose the NCR to have a somewhat benevolent attitude toward the Enclave.

And, well... If the NCR could convince the "Great Pegasus Enclave" to break its isolationism and become a State of the Republic... wouldn't it be great ? :D


As for the Philomenans, they are a continent away. What kind of cooperation would you see in such circumstances ?

[Harmony Ltd.]

Idle thought, but how complicated do you think it would be for the NCR to retro-engineer and manufacture balefire eggs ?

I had a vision of a few wings of pegasi and griffins delivering some Easter Goodies on a certain fortified position...

[Harmony Ltd.]

Idle thought, but how complicated do you think it would be for the NCR to retro-engineer and manufacture balefire eggs ?

I had a vision of a few wings of pegasi and griffins delivering some Easter Goodies on a certain fortified position...

Do you know what is the definition of "overkill" ?

This with balefire-egg-tipped rockets.

[Meleagridis]

I am not used to so many words.

Sounds like a good plan. I can't at the moment think of a good counter to the sand dog version, but I'd also say that it's less likely that the NCR will have that kind of support than that it won't.

Good old fashioned biological warfare? Remember when Discord beefed up some bunnies for the hell of it? Let's say his juices could be put to use replicating that effect, and give the specimens a tunneling capacity on par with sand dogs. Once the problem of explosive breeding is solved (which, of course, it never would be) these super-bunnies would make a cheaper source of labour than Hoofington sand dogs. They'd be cheaper, more easily directed, and there wouldn't be any more trouble with those pesky 'civil rights' that get dog-sympathizers all worked up. If such a thing were to exist, perhaps there might be a reason to start the project in a facility by the Moojave... or maybe use the resources of a nearby school. Bam! Instant ponified tunnelers, the deathclaw killers from Lonesome Road. A solution to infiltration by specialist dog forces, already prepped and waiting to spiral out of control and bite its directors in the butt with explosive bunny breeding.

By the way, Spike Cave's, because it is where the Gardens of Equestria are located, might become one of the most heavily defended place on the Peninsula.

In time even more heavily defended than Hoofington.

If people know about it. He probably wouldn't appreciate much publicity, especially if he needs to take another nap some time in the future. Remember that he is not only a dragon, but an individual who's worked alone for a very long time. That creates stubbornness that can fly in the face of all logic. If he accepted help, that alone would be something big.

Also, I'm wondering if the NCR's anti-slavery policies extend to brahmin.

Before starting expanding into the Moojave, people would probably not even think about the issue.

After, though, if only for the very practical issues raised by trying to convert the locals, Brahmins may be granted citizenship. Though, still in practice, they would probably keep being used in the same way, just with officially the right to self-determination. I guess most would be officially employed in the big Caravan companies ?

Doesn't mean they will actually be treated as equals everywhere, but heh, you don't change more than two centuries of social history just like that.

The big question is if brahmin will still be penned up and treated like animals- even the ones that are basically animals. The Moojave is the only safe haven for them, and it's not even that great a haven. The Guai will probably get angry and butt heads no matter what happens, but if the NCR brings back a prejudice that has almost been exorcised from local area then near everyone from Great Cows to civilians will be consider it an active act of aggression. It will be flight or fight for them, and the Moojave is where you go when you choose to run.

It won't end well. Even the Guai can't compete with an honest-to-goodness army. The brahmin's only defence will be the NCR's hesitation to be responsible for mass slaughter, really.Of course, mass slaughter is a nice way to change more than two centuries of social history. If it is publicized.

But- again -this all depends on what will change by the post-pip era. But the only way this particular solidarity would waver is if all major brahmin-independence movements were taken out some time in the past. If smart brahmin go the way of smart deathclaws from the game.

As for why there's so much griffins ? I'll say : the wonders of oviparous reproduction when applied to a civilized society.

Honestly surprised there aren't more. You'd think that a griffin being at the head of one of the first new emergent governments would be good inspiration for the remaining independents to fly under her banner.

NCR flag...

The obvious inspiration would be :



However, it wouldn't quite fit with the history behind the Republic.

The NCR's flag would need to represent Strength in Unity and Unity in Diversity.

Any idea ?

Spoiler:

Okay, I just pulled these off of google image. (By the way, most of the results from that search were random images from this here site. Thought that was funny.)
I know I'm a little late to this, yeah, but is there an existing pony flag anywhere? It might have a good template for modification.

How about that ?

It's a step away from nuclear radiation with all the clear green and blue. Appropriate, considering what the republic is. It seems to say, "Moving on from all that business."

I'm a bit confused regarding what you mean here. I was thinking (and, I though, describing) Rose Radio as being a separate station (maybe with multiple channels, later, if the amount of non-music content gets high enough) broadcast from Thornbush and run by Banner members, the DJ probably originally one of the foals from Fillydelphia. Competition, if any, would be friendly (and there might indeed be some trading of material), but they wouldn't be the same station.

Also, when you say "a single voice", I assume you actually mean "two voices, but both belonging to the same person"?

Eheh, my mistake. When you said, "Radio Moojave was joined," I read, "Radio Moojave was combined." And I apologize for not grammaring very well lately. It's so clear in my head!

And yes, two voices on the radio=one radio host. But they (Rose Banner) wouldn't have much reason to go snooping unless Radio Moojave started passing on information that hurt the Banner. Which could happen, I guess. But they don't raid for slaves, right? Is there really anything they do that would be bad for Moojave citizens?

I recall Homage using the SPP towers still, yeah.

Regarding Stridula getting the news, I seem to recall that the Big 52's radio station (I forget the name; I never actually finished Pink Eyes) used actual people on the ground with two-way radios calling in; Pink Eyes isn't part of my headcanon, but perhaps Radio Moojave could use something like that.

Regarding broadcast location, well, Moover West and Moover East probably had the same equipment as Moover South. If that-- Oh, hang on, I misread. You're saying that Stridula gathers her own news (in disguise, of course, not that that's difficult), relays her words to the Radio Moojave broadcast location, and sends them out from there? Hm… Yes, it could be difficult… I don't seem to have any ideas at the moment. In range of Westside (still no feedback on that name, by the way) or possible Moover East, she might be able to set up relays, but out of range… Hm. Also, how would her mountain hideaway have enough power to broadcast a signal across the entire Moojave? The altitude would help, of course, but the mountains might also get in the way… again, hm…

I hope I don't have to learn how radios work to get this figured out. Then again, never hurts to learn. Hrblbbrblbm... did zebras use radios of any sort? Pre-war spy station in the mountains? An old Minotaur project to kill all radiowaves, maybe? After the failure and evacuation of its creator, re-jiggered to broadcast? Or maybe it would be simpler to just broadcast from the Guai Encowmpment. Which would be kind of funny because the nastiest gang in the valley houses the most helpful personality that routinely thwarts their own attacks. But that makes for less technical conflicts- less "how does the power get there" and more "why has nobody beaten up the chatty pony?"

Also, I swear I intended to approve of Westside- just forgot. I like anything that parallels with even the smallest detail of Fallout. Westside and Westside have nothing in common, but the name makes sense for the fort and doesn't disrupt anything. The name also makes it clear that, despite appearances, we're dealing with a town and not a base. Civilians, spouses, children, food vendors, lives. If that's what lives in Westside, then the name is appropriate. It... was a town, right?

I've been pondering what Stable(s) to put in the Moojave, by the way. I'm so far thinking of one out in the middle of the desert, next to APE's headquarters (which I'm also still pondering putting in the Moojave), but I'm not sure what to make the number or experiment. Also, it was supposed to be unusual that Stable 2 stayed closed for so long (and 99 wasn't actually given any instructions about how long to stay closed), so, if we wanted a Stable dweller (as opposed to the Stable Dweller, of course), we'd have to work that in.

I've already got a setup for Stable 92, if that helps. And the reason I was looking for a nice idyllic place for Cloud is a buffalo/earth pony stable where a bomb was basically left in the Overchief's office until some dunderhead set it off.

Do you mean that he'd leave the south bank alone and wage mooerilla warfare (:D) against the Banner on the north bank or that he'd send mooerillas over? You used "the other side of the river" twice, and I'm not sure whether the second time meant the same thing as the first time or whether it meant "The other side from the point of view of the side that the first use of the phrase moved the point of view to".

Erp. I mean he wouldn't cross the river to the south bank. And he'd make it very clear that anyone crossing over to the north bank would be unwelcome. He'd try and set the river as a border for his forces.

Nice! And that solves at least some of my concerns from earlier (ie, how does she power the broadcast). There's still the news relaying problem, though… a PipBuck broadcaster sending to the Encowmpment can only work for so far. The Encompment tower probably has a pretty clear view north, though, which ought to help.

Of course, this also puts the Encowmpment pretty close to Westside, which is not likely to be a terribly amiable neighborship…

I completely forgot an idea from earlier... she wasn't supposed to be working alone. She was supposed to have help from a minotaur tuned into a particular frequency... but I can't remember how that worked, or even if it would help. I'm brain farting on this one, might have to look at it later. Would one-way communication with an assistant help matters at all?

As for Westside... so long as they aren't actively racist, avoid dealings with slavers and never come into contact with mad cows, they should be more or less left alone. Still, it wouldn't take much more than suspicion for wandering Guai to attack out-and-about Westsiders.

With Great Cows and Cow Guai having such different reputations, I suppose they'll need some easy way to distinguish the two...

Well, the thing is, that stuff about Littlehorn being remote? That was before the war even started (truly pre-war). The Moover Line wasn't even a twinkle in an architect's eye yet; the population of that area probably consisted of less than ten ponies running the bridge, a few more to the east running the canals (along with zebras, since it was still a cooperative effort at the time). And after Littlehorn the event, well… would you want to build there? Crescent Moon Canyon was pretty much abandoned before the Ministries had fully formed. And as for being idyllic nature? It's on the edge of Equestria, in a mountain valley with active water flow, and nowhere near much of anything at all. Far away from any megaspell hits.

Hm. Canals?

[Harmony Ltd.]

New attempt at an NCR flag :

Spoiler:

Symbolism :

Spoiler:

[Harmony Ltd.]

Honestly surprised there aren't more. You'd think that a griffin being at the head of one of the first new emergent governments would be good inspiration for the remaining independents to fly under her banner.

It's already around 1 griffin for every 7 ponies. That's a lotsa griffins.

(By the way, most of the results from that search were random images from this here site. Thought that was funny.)

lol. What were the search terms you entered ? Because I don't see it with "new canterlot republic flag".

It's a step away from nuclear radiation with all the clear green and blue. Appropriate, considering what the republic is. It seems to say, "Moving on from all that business."

Pretty much, though in the latest version there's still a reminder that everything has a cost associated with it (the NCR was born of struggle, after all).



More answer to you and Hinds later.

[Meleagridis]

Also, any thoughts, anyone, on national anthems for any of these parties? The Pax Roaman has Ohe Zebrae and the Miliozi their unnamed (that is, it probably has a name, but I don't know it) song to the tune of the Marcia Reale, but I'm not sure what to use for the Alliance or NCR. The Banner might also have an anthem.
(I think that, given the nationality of a certain major poster in this thread, it would be fun to use La Marseillaise somewhere. :D)

We are Cow
Strong and proud
Though we need not say it loud
For our might and prowess speaks for us

With the perfect martial form,
we can weather any storm

We are Cow, we are Cow, we are Cooooooooow...

Admittedly this is more of a gang's wake-up call than a national anthem. But I could not pass up the opportunity.

[O. Hinds]

As far as the relations between the NCR and the Enclave Remnants go... don't forget the NCR donate / trade at a loss huge amounts of food with the Remnants (as a way to maintain the peace and preemptively counter any possible rhetoric from the Enclave about the surfacers starving them). The real grudge would go against the Bitters, and it has already been consummated during the War and the "reeducation and reintegration" of the Biters who were made prisonner of war or surrendered. Also, it's important to remember that roughly a third of the NCR pony population (something like a fourth of its total population ?) would have grown up in the Enclave or be descended from people who grew up there. So it would predispose the NCR to have a somewhat benevolent attitude toward the Enclave.

Ah, I had forgotten that, sorry, and I'd been thinking that the Remnants had a higher proportion of Bitters.

As for the Philomenans, they are a continent away. What kind of cooperation would you see in such circumstances ?

Well, less than I was thinking before, now that my knowledge of the Remnants has been corrected, but the Philomenans do still have a mostly-operational thunderhead. Sure, many of the ventral guns are probably smashed up and the thing isn't currently flight-capable, but if it could be repaired…
Also, where are they Remnants planning to put New Cloudsdayle? If the NCR hasn't convinced them to join by the time it's complete, well, the Philomenans are an isolated, mostly pegasus-run society with an already-extant population of groundling agricultural serfs… I mean, yeah, it would take a while to move New Cloudsdayle all the way over there… but given that a New Cloudsdayle keeping to itself way over on the west coast of Zebrica is much less of a threat that a New Clousdayle that's a member of the NCR, something tells me that Elusive would, out of the kindness of his heart, of course, be happy to sell cheap food and food transportation to New Cloudsdayle en route.

Idle thought, but how complicated do you think it would be for the NCR to retro-engineer and manufacture balefire eggs ?

I had a vision of a few wings of pegasi and griffins delivering some Easter Goodies on a certain fortified position...

Hm… I don't know. Unless they can find an appropriate ghoul or possibly a changeling…

Do you know what is the definition of "overkill" ?

This with balefire-egg-tipped rockets.

:D
The Alliance, given that it has Profectum and active vehicle creation, already has such tech. Imagine a trio of Skysharks cresting a hill and opening up with their rocket pods. Of course, such weapons do tend to have a nasty habit of irradiating the target area, and, if the other side has them too, it could be seen as escalation…

Good old fashioned biological warfare? Remember when Discord beefed up some bunnies for the hell of it? Let's say his juices could be put to use replicating that effect, and give the specimens a tunneling capacity on par with sand dogs. Once the problem of explosive breeding is solved (which, of course, it never would be) these super-bunnies would make a cheaper source of labour than Hoofington sand dogs. They'd be cheaper, more easily directed, and there wouldn't be any more trouble with those pesky 'civil rights' that get dog-sympathizers all worked up. If such a thing were to exist, perhaps there might be a reason to start the project in a facility by the Moojave... or maybe use the resources of a nearby school. Bam! Instant ponified tunnelers, the deathclaw killers from Lonesome Road. A solution to infiltration by specialist dog forces, already prepped and waiting to spiral out of control and bite its directors in the butt with explosive bunny breeding.

…PHAHAHAHAHAHA! Very nice! Though… wasn't all the taint cleared away by Gardens? Or is the NCR using stocks that were out of the county for some reason?

The big question is if brahmin will still be penned up and treated like animals- even the ones that are basically animals. The Moojave is the only safe haven for them, and it's not even that great a haven. The Guai will probably get angry and butt heads no matter what happens, but if the NCR brings back a prejudice that has almost been exorcised from local area then near everyone from Great Cows to civilians will be consider it an active act of aggression. It will be flight or fight for them, and the Moojave is where you go when you choose to run.

It won't end well. Even the Guai can't compete with an honest-to-goodness army. The brahmin's only defence will be the NCR's hesitation to be responsible for mass slaughter, really.Of course, mass slaughter is a nice way to change more than two centuries of social history. If it is publicized.

Hm… Could Rose Eye use that to pull an "enemy of my enemy" temporary alliance (assuming that the NCR does indeed do that)?

But- again -this all depends on what will change by the post-pip era. But the only way this particular solidarity would waver is if all major brahmin-independence movements were taken out some time in the past. If smart brahmin go the way of smart deathclaws from the game.

I use the Restoration Patch and, so far, have in all of my complete playthroughs found an excuse to go to Navarro first and kill the doctor. :)

Eheh, my mistake. When you said, "Radio Moojave was joined," I read, "Radio Moojave was combined." And I apologize for not grammaring very well lately. It's so clear in my head!

:)

And yes, two voices on the radio=one radio host. But they (Rose Banner) wouldn't have much reason to go snooping unless Radio Moojave started passing on information that hurt the Banner. Which could happen, I guess. But they don't raid for slaves, right?

They don't raid Moojave settlements. People migrating into the Moojave had better either be brahmin, be otherwise friends with the locals, be really heavily armed, or mind their behavior, though. The Banner also sends occasional expeditions north or south, and they've deals with local settlements such that, if a troublemaker is captured alive and would usually just be executed (Wasteland justice not having that many more options that "lock them up for a few days" and "shoot them"), they're handed over to the Banner instead (particularly since it may have been Banner aid troops who did the capturing).

Is there really anything they do that would be bad for Moojave citizens?

Well, some might argue that their existence is bad for the Moojave, but the Banner has been trying to build as much local goodwill as possible. Their arrival was probably the harshest they've been to the locals; Rose Eye offered the people of Westside a fair, mutually beneficial, and temporary deal, but the only alternative to accepting the deal was for the Banner to try to take over Westside. That earned the Banner some bad press, I expect, but Rose (somewhat surprisingly, to many) ended up keeping the deal after Westside accepted it.

Hrblbbrblbm... did zebras use radios of any sort?

Um, yes. :)

Which would be kind of funny because the nastiest gang in the valley houses the most helpful personality that routinely thwarts their own attacks. But that makes for less technical conflicts- less "how does the power get there" and more "why has nobody beaten up the chatty pony?"

Aye, that's sounding good. I was agreeing to it before; what I'm wondering about is how best to relay messages back to the Encowmpment for broadcast when Stridula's out of range. I'm not sure how far a PipBuck broadcaster can send… Though perhaps Stridula's modified hers to be able to beam instead of broadcast? That could boost the range, though she'd need a line of sight to the Encowmpment.

Also, I swear I intended to approve of Westside- just forgot. I like anything that parallels with even the smallest detail of Fallout. Westside and Westside have nothing in common, but the name makes sense for the fort and doesn't disrupt anything. The name also makes it clear that, despite appearances, we're dealing with a town and not a base. Civilians, spouses, children, food vendors, lives. If that's what lives in Westside, then the name is appropriate.

Ah, nice!

It... was a town, right?

Yes. :) Westside is the town built in Moover West and people mostly by the descendants of the Moover Line's garrison (well, those who survived the Final Assault).

I've already got a setup for Stable 92, if that helps. And the reason I was looking for a nice idyllic place for Cloud is a buffalo/earth pony stable where a bomb was basically left in the Overchief's office until some dunderhead set it off.

Cloud? Sorry, I think that I presently lack too much information to be able to comment on this.

Erp. I mean he wouldn't cross the river to the south bank. And he'd make it very clear that anyone crossing over to the north bank would be unwelcome. He'd try and set the river as a border for his forces.

Ah, I see. If the Guai are still strong when the Banner starts sending aid troops (if they do under these circumstances) to communities north of the river, things could get interesting…

I completely forgot an idea from earlier... she wasn't supposed to be working alone. She was supposed to have help from a minotaur tuned into a particular frequency... but I can't remember how that worked, or even if it would help. I'm brain farting on this one, might have to look at it later. Would one-way communication with an assistant help matters at all?

Um. Well, see, the problem isn't at all sending things from the Encowmpment; the transmitter there has more than enough power, and we probably only need to worry about big terrain obstruction. The problem is that I don't know how strong the available portable transmitters are; it's sending messages to the Encowmpment from the field that concerns me.

As for Westside... so long as they aren't actively racist, avoid dealings with slavers and never come into contact with mad cows, they should be more or less left alone. Still, it wouldn't take much more than suspicion for wandering Guai to attack out-and-about Westsiders.

Well, I hadn't thought about their racism (I'd been assuming that you'd be developing their culture, actually, given they way that this project started), but they've probably, if nothing else, learned by now that being openly racist against brahmin can in the Moojave be very bad for one's health. If the Guai are still operating when the Banner arrives, though… Well, I doubt that even the Guai (due to Papa Cow's guidance) would blame Westside too much for their initial work with the Banner, since it was either that or have the Banner attack and try to enslave them. After that, though… yeah…

Hm. Canals?

Remember, the river/canal system over the isthmus?

New attempt at an NCR flag :

Spoiler:

Symbolism :

Spoiler:

Hm… Aye, this is good. I'm not sure whether I prefer the Elements in an arc or a ring, but either's fine.

Also, any thoughts, anyone, on national anthems for any of these parties? The Pax Roaman has Ohe Zebrae and the Miliozi their unnamed (that is, it probably has a name, but I don't know it) song to the tune of the Marcia Reale, but I'm not sure what to use for the Alliance or NCR. The Banner might also have an anthem.
(I think that, given the nationality of a certain major poster in this thread, it would be fun to use La Marseillaise somewhere. :D)

We are Cow
Strong and proud
Though we need not say it loud
For our might and prowess speaks for us

With the perfect martial form,
we can weather any storm

We are Cow, we are Cow, we are Cooooooooow...

Admittedly this is more of a gang's wake-up call than a national anthem. But I could not pass up the opportunity.

:D


For the Banner… I don't know, random idea, but maybe something based on Auferstanden aus Ruinen? Probably not, but it's the best idea that I've had so far in this.

[cb5]

I actually had a decent thought into how their technology may work.

Power armor has been in a ton of video games and such, but what is it? How does it work?

What if it's not actually plates of armor? It could be particles with the consistency of water and act like fine sand that contract when force is applied and contract extremely densely to impact points that it's shape is held together by the actual plating. Like normally the inside particles are swishing and swashing about doing their own thing while you're going on about your day. Then a raider pops out with a HUGE sledgehammer and hits you. In fractions of a second the inside particles would have the force being pushed into them, they would harden and form a dense structure behind the impact point and counter the force.

Imagine senator armstrong's nanomachines from msg reveangence.


Also on the idea of levitation talismans. If they knew about higgs particles then well just use magic to create a anti-higgs particle to cancel some of it out in the area. The downside is that if they worked that way then why not just create cars, airplanes, trains with a ton of levitation spells and save a ton of money on your fuels. However the raptors and such probably do use levitation talismans. They were probably just misappropriated during construction.

I can see it now some engineer going to his boss saying, "Sir, since this war is being fought over energy resources, why not just cut our dependence on foreign fuel sources by reducing the amount of fuel transport vehicles need by a insane amount?"
"I like your idea. Let's instead use them to make flying battleships that will just exasperate the problem even further with the battleships now not only having to move, but fight against gravity further making us dependent on foreign fuels"
". . ."


As for how they use spell matrixes to compute, maybe the magic has the ability to be used like computer circuitry when imbued into a physical object used as circuitry. Like how quantum particles can be used for computing and such. It would explain their societal issues as well. If they found magic can be used for computing without properly understanding it first it would lead to their society developing too fast without properly getting used to it.

What I mean by that if imagine our society in the pre-industrial era stumbled across something that let them do quantum computing . . . Chances are that would not have ended well.

As for how EFS could work through walls it could be multiple types of sensor working in tandem. If you have something that tracks not just sound, motion, heat and such it wouldn't give a 100% accurate tracking system, but rather show the general area a pony is at. Kind of like the sensor from Aliens where the sensor overlays sound and disturbances in the air to tell which direction motion is coming from.

[O. Hinds]

As for the NCR's anthem… if I may try my hand again at songwriting…

Spoiler:

[O. Hinds]

Oh, yes, and I keep forgetting to ask:
Meleagridis, what are your thoughts on Pain Train? That rare thing, a fully sane minotaur? Or do the different voices in his head just happen to get along really well?

[Harmony Ltd.]

As far as the relations between the NCR and the Enclave Remnants go... don't forget the NCR donate / trade at a loss huge amounts of food with the Remnants (as a way to maintain the peace and preemptively counter any possible rhetoric from the Enclave about the surfacers starving them). The real grudge would go against the Bitters, and it has already been consummated during the War and the "reeducation and reintegration" of the Biters who were made prisonner of war or surrendered. Also, it's important to remember that roughly a third of the NCR pony population (something like a fourth of its total population ?) would have grown up in the Enclave or be descended from people who grew up there. So it would predispose the NCR to have a somewhat benevolent attitude toward the Enclave.

Ah, I had forgotten that, sorry, and I'd been thinking that the Remnants had a higher proportion of Bitters.

Well, yes, the Remnants do have a number of ex-Bitters among them, who rejoined after the defeat had become clear. Something like 25% of their total population...

How to put it... The relations between the NCR and the Enclave Remnants is complicated.

Despite the appearances, neither the NCR's nor the Remnants' political leadership are monolithic, united blocks. There's a number of different factions, with different visions on a number of topics.

It doesn't help, in the case of the Enclave, that the Schism forced the Remnants to become to some extent a -bit- more democratic in its decision-making process, or at least to consult with the common citizens on matters which if left unresolved might lead to another Schism.

[Harmony Ltd.]

So in short, even if there might be good will going both ways, the scares in both societies still haven't completely healed, and it's doubtful they'll ever completely.

[O. Hinds]

As far as the relations between the NCR and the Enclave Remnants go... don't forget the NCR donate / trade at a loss huge amounts of food with the Remnants (as a way to maintain the peace and preemptively counter any possible rhetoric from the Enclave about the surfacers starving them). The real grudge would go against the Bitters, and it has already been consummated during the War and the "reeducation and reintegration" of the Biters who were made prisonner of war or surrendered. Also, it's important to remember that roughly a third of the NCR pony population (something like a fourth of its total population ?) would have grown up in the Enclave or be descended from people who grew up there. So it would predispose the NCR to have a somewhat benevolent attitude toward the Enclave.

Ah, I had forgotten that, sorry, and I'd been thinking that the Remnants had a higher proportion of Bitters.

Well, yes, the Remnants do have a number of ex-Bitters among them, who rejoined after the defeat had become clear. Something like 25% of their total population...

How to put it... The relations between the NCR and the Enclave Remnants is complicated.

Despite the appearances, neither the NCR's nor the Remnants' political leadership are monolithic, united blocks. There's a number of different factions, with different visions on a number of topics.

It doesn't help, in the case of the Enclave, that the Schism forced the Remnants to become to some extent a -bit- more democratic in its decision-making process, or at least to consult with the common citizens on matters which if left unresolved might lead to another Schism.

So in short, even if there might be good will going both ways, the scares in both societies still haven't completely healed, and it's doubtful they'll ever completely.

Ah, I see (I think); thanks.

[Harmony Ltd.]

Basically, it's complex enough to build intricate stories of political intrigues and spy games on top of it.

[Harmony Ltd.]

By the way, I like your reinterpretation of the USSR's anthem.

[O. Hinds]

Basically, it's complex enough to build intricate stories of political intrigues and spy games on top of it.

:D

By the way, I like your reinterpretation of the USSR's anthem.

Oh, thanks. I'm surprised that it's that good.


I assume that replies to the other stuff that I posted are still pending? No rush, just want to make sure that they haven't been forgotten.

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