Re: [GRIMDARK] Fallout Equestria: Project Horizons Discussion

[SilentCarto]

Heh, that's... amusing. Pip's mom never got a name at all, did she?

[CD]

Spoiler:

I'm interested to see how the party spends their time in Rice River. They haven't really proven themselves as heroes and all of them need to mature. Of course, given their employer, things can go south before the year is out. I also have an inkling that Carnico is going to have trouble on their hooves from the protagonists at some point. And is it just me, or does it sound like Vicious may in fact be Blackjack, going incognito?

[RoboRed]

Nah, I think Blackjack is doing spooky ghostjack things back in the Hoof. Or still being "dead".
I dunno, I can't quite remember the timeline of what happened.

[SilentCarto]

And is it just me, or does it sound like Vicious may in fact be Blackjack, going incognito?

She really strikes me more as a Zodiac type. Vicious is dangerously competent, where BJ was kinda just dangerous. Anyway, Scotch would see through that disguise in a Manehattan minute.

As far as I know, Blankjack should still be unconscious in 99. I don't think enough time has passed for the land around the Hoofington crater to be replanted and flourishing yet. If there's a year-long time skip, maybe, but I kind of have a feeling things are going to go south before the month is out. Even if they don't, I wouldn't count on BJ showing up in this story, even as a cameo.

[Somber]

It's not Blackjack.  Also, thank you for the feedback.

Vicious is one of those characters where I need an NPC and think "Wouldn't this be cool?" because the Syndicate is the one entity in the zebralands that honestly, sincerely, doesn't give a fuck of you are zebra, pony, ghoul, griffon, or whatever.  If you can do the job, are reliable, and honorable then you're in.  For this reason, they're a big threat to the status quo.

Also, Vicious likes to kill.  Likes to fuck.  Likes to party.  Likes to be happy.  She's Rampage without the death wish and Blackjack without the ethics.  As to if she's a GOOD pony... probably not.

[Icy Shake]

“All life? Like… even flesh-eating bacteria?” Pythia asked.
“Even that should be respected, its spirit sent away and appeased rather than killed with chemicals and poison,” she retorted.
So basically she's a zebra Jehovah's Witness?

When I read it, I was thinking Jain.

“Why? I scavenged it and fixed it up myself! I didn’t steal–” And then it came to her. “You mean they think I’m a thief ‘cause I’m a pony?!”
It's nice to see that in zebra land, zebras hold the some racist preconceptions white people have about blacks. It makes me feel less privileged.

My initial reaction to that was "looks like Scotch is picking up a DWP."

The author's note saying that it really is jumping ahead or covering a year is what most surprised me: the pulling back from direct focus and only minor breaks in the flow of time for the most part is a big change, but has definite advantages. And though it's not exactly the same, allowing for things like seeing the not-Scotch kids in the swamp or the end of this chapter is a big plus of the move to full time 3rd person narration, even if it's mostly kept pretty close to Scotch.

editing:

[RoboRed]

Also, Vicious likes to kill. Likes to fuck. Likes to party. Likes to be happy. She's Rampage without the death wish and Blackjack without the ethics. As to if she's a GOOD pony... probably not.

I can see this as leading to a potentially exciting situation.

[O. Hinds]

@Icy Shake:
Ah, thank you very much as always.

The section with the smiling isn't in 68; I found it in 70.

[Kattlarv]

Well, as more than me was interested in the answer to this: What was it about the PH ending that made people utterly ignore PH once they finished it?
I've had a few experiences with games, novels and movies that made me not want to ever pick it up again. But considering people are exited for the new project, it seems like PH's case was due to a positive event.

But yeah, those of you that hasn't just left: What about PH's ending made so many of you never wanting to re-read it? Too big? Satisfying/Dissatisfying ending? I was asked to asked, so I've done just that =P

[O. Hinds]

Hm, well, for me, I don't think that it was the ending. It's just a very long story, I've already been through it pretty intimately, and I have other things to do and other stories to read for the first time.

[SilentCarto]

Yeah, I think that's about it. Picking up a long-running fic does require a bit of an investment on the reader's part -- and when it's an ongoing fic, there's a sense that you're somehow running late until you've read the new chapter. (Not that it isn't a hundred times more effort on Somber's part!) PH was great, but it was a hell of a marathon, and it's nice to sit back, take a breath, and say, "Okay, all done." I'm loving Homelands, and I didn't hesitate to start reading it, but I'm just as happy that Somber isn't sticking to a weekly/bi-weekly schedule.

[Kattlarv]

Makes sense. It is like, a pretty retarded length if you just compare it to other literature heh :P
It would be sooo phat in paper form xD

But I guess that could be it.
Was just really curious how come so many never wanted to have anything to do with PH ever again. Was just really "eh?" on why so many just waved topics regarding PH away as they were "done with it". Was just curious if it had done a "Panty and Stocking", or what the reason for the large number of "never again!" towards it was. But nice to know it seems to be due to positive reasons.

[Bootleg]

Retarded is literally the opposite word to describe the length of PH.
 As for me, I haven't started a re-read yet because I'm still letting the story stew in my mind for another few months, or until someone starts up a physical copy thingy like they did for the original FoE.

[Kattlarv]

Welp. It was the best term I could come up with on the fly xP But yeah, wasn't it like, x2 the length of the bible?
And hum, first one I hear interested in re-reading it. Guess that's a nice sign :P

[Icy Shake]

Yeah, I think that's about it. Picking up a long-running fic does require a bit of an investment on the reader's part -- and when it's an ongoing fic, there's a sense that you're somehow running late until you've read the new chapter. (Not that it isn't a hundred times more effort on Somber's part!) PH was great, but it was a hell of a marathon, and it's nice to sit back, take a breath, and say, "Okay, all done." I'm loving Homelands, and I didn't hesitate to start reading it, but I'm just as happy that Somber isn't sticking to a weekly/bi-weekly schedule.

Some of this is that I agree with O. Hinds. But there's also this. I've been relatively involved both with PH and Homelands, but it's not necessarily resulted in much conversation. There are a few things that push that way. One is that as of approximately when PH ended, I've had a lot less time available to engage with fanfic of any variety. But more specifically, there have been some PH related effects. One is that the relevant point for new discussion has not been this thread, but Homelands on Fimfiction. Even disregarding that, any further discussion of PH would require choosing a topic out of PH itself. It is much harder to latch onto a topic out of 1.8 million words than out of ~20-25 thousand from a chapter post. Because a conversation requires a confluence of interest, not merely that of one person; that's why I've managed something of a dialogue on PH's Fimfic page, but not here: I've been responding to someone else who has been offering little comments as he's read through a chapter at a time. Granted, I'd have probably guaranteed about a post per week here if my personal situation had remained the same since last year, but I wouldn't have expected much engagement from that. The modal response from my chapter posts was, I believe, one from O. Hinds, acknowledging the editing issues I highlighted. And there's nothing wrong with that, even from the perspective of people reading what I thought about a given chapter: after all, those posts grew out of me noting errors I noticed from the readings of the chapters as I went through them, mostly while driving. The fact is, the best chance for conversation is new content, and because the publication strategy of Homelands has been through Fimfiction (and EQD's FoE omnibus update posts, (admittedly, I'm not sure why Homelands doesn't get a sequel post like so many other stories do)), it doesn't direct much traffic here. It's too bad, and of course the threading there isn't as good for ongoing discussion. But it's where the eyeballs are. And without new content (where the natural focal point is this particular thread), there's nothing to direct attention to any particular point and stimulate conversation.

[SilentCarto]

The first rule of Homelands is you do not talk about Homelands!
The second rule of Homelands is you do not talk about Homelands!

[Somber]

Why not talk about homelands?

[SilentCarto]

It was just a joking reference to Fight Club.

[Somber]

Yeah, but he was really talking about his own schizophrenia.  Please, talk about it!

[SilentCarto]

Smiling Jack whipped the hat off his bare skull, giving me a hard stare with empty eye sockets. Then he waved vaguely toward the bed. "Sit."

What could I do? I sat. "Answer me. Why do people think you're me?"

The skeleton slowly slid the hat back on his head, grinning the whole time. "I think you know."

"No, I don't," I said.

"Yes, you do. Why would anypony possibly confuse me with you?"

"I... I don't know," I insisted, but an image flashed in my mind's eye. A field of bones, armored pegasi. Yellow River. A bloody rib was clutched... in my own hand.

Smiling Jack -- Wasteland -- whatever his name was, the bony bastard cocked his head, eyeing me with empty sockets. "You got it."

"No..." I whispered. Another flash -- a little pink filly screaming my name as my hooves came down on her.

His skinless face leered at me. "Say it."

"Because..." I trailed off. Flash -- a fever dream. I pushed forty chips into the middle of a table, then flipped the cards. My loss. I pushed the chips toward an empty chair.

"Say it!"

"Because I am the wasteland."

[SilentCarto]

I've got a pretty typical fan question I've been wanting to ask:
Those here that read Homelands... do you have a favorite among the new mane 4?

I don't, actually, and that really surprised me. Each of them charms and annoys me by turns, which I think makes them come off as both more three-dimensional and more childlike. They frequently create their own obstacles, which is good for storytelling.

In particular, I like how Scotch is smart and savvy, which means she can frequently cut through bullshit to the simplest solution, but at the same time, she tends to shoot off her mouth and offend those who hold the bullshit sacred, and she has yet to learn to see the line between bullshit and stuff she just didn't know yet. And I'm liking the early hints of latent shamanism shading into technomancy.

[Kattlarv]

Either case: Blah... wish I could get my motivation going again. Want to pick up with the revisions again. First gotta un-fuck the minor changes and just stick to the major ones. Then keep fixing contradictions, plot holes and inconsistencies. Not too many of them, but get poked about resuming every now and then.

Something kinda tells me that with the current situations, I will either be finished when homelands is finished. And/or I will finish when the few people that have interest to revisit PH, has already done it. Things really don't like being easy xD Ah well. I will hopefully get around to it someday. By this point it's more of a principal thing if anything xD I'm gonna get to the end of both. Maybe not this year. But by Gummy am I going to do it xP

At least thanks to feedback figured out what the main edit issue was: Drolling on about stuff. Many of the minor changes apparently worked, but was ruined when they were repeated. So hey, progress I guess hehe.
Kinda curious if I'll pick up homelands afterwards. But it might be really good if Somber has learned from their mistakes in PH. From the sounds of it, that might be the case going how people are discussing it ^^

[Somber]

Or you could write your own stories.  That's an option.  And yes, I have learned.  I am trying to keep the references close to zero.  While it's going to be a big story, it hopefully won't have the power creep.  Cross my fingers and hope for the best.

[SilentCarto]

Either case: Blah... wish I could get my motivation going again.

There was an interesting tweet I saw the other day on that topic, oddly enough.
https://twitter.com/heyjenbartel/status/725962950738120704

"Better to cultivate discipline than to rely on motivation... Discipline is reliable, motivation is fleeting. The question isn't how to keep yourself motivated, it's how to train yourself to work without it."

This is talking about doing anything creative professionally, mind you, but when you combine that with Walt Stanchfield's "ten thousand bad drawings"...

[Icy Shake]

I'm right with SilentCarto on Scotch Tape, though I'm hoping that after the year's time skip she'll at least be a bit better at keeping some of her opinions on the spirit/general zebra stuff to herself, even if she's not seen enough in that time (being kind of shut up in one place) to really buy into it.

My other is Pythia, whose sense of humor and general put-upon attitude just work for me. Add to that how she's the one with a real, definite goal and the development of weird stuff going on (Scotch too, of course), and that goes a long way.

I like when Majina gets to do her Zencori thing or be silly (like on the ship when Scotch was trying to work), and the direction she's taken in the last chapter, but I've tended to get annoyed with her for the same reasons that Pythia did.

It feels like Precious has tended to have less focus on her, and didn't get much chance to shine until the big car chase a chapter back. But she might also be the most grounded of the lot, apart from her self-assessment regarding her durability.

[Valikdu]

There was a PH-themed cosplaying group at PonyRadioCon. Actually, I think it was the only real group there (if you don't count the judges: Dixidana and Erinliona)

For some reason, there aren't many pictures released yet, though there were multiple photographers.

YOU SEE COMRADE, IF HOLD RPG FOR WHACKING...:

With Ketika (Littlepip) and some dude.:

Glory:

Lancer and Velvet Remedy:

With Dixidana. This is her "not preparing at all" for the convention.:

"DO I HAVE TO SHOOT YOU IN THE FACE AGAIN?!?!?!":

Um... help:

[Somber]

That is so cool!  I've met the BJ player and I love the glory player!

[SilentCarto]

Okay, I am completely confused by the Atoli trial in ch. 6. The captain of Abalone who asked for Pythia's help was named Mahealani. Lalahawa was her daughter, Sky Altar. (Edit: I mean Blue Pearl. I can't keep their names straight either, apparently!) Surely you just used the wrong name, right?

[Icy Shake]

Okay, I am completely confused by the Atoli trial in ch. 6. The captain of Abalone who asked for Pythia's help was named Mahealani. Lalahawa was her daughter, Sky Altar. Surely you just used the wrong name, right?

. . . Looks that way.

Random question: does anyone remember about when Stygius became PH's Flash-Sentry-before-Flash-Sentry-existed? Was it right away, or did it take a while? I think I remember it getting more pronounced (if not starting) when he and Whisper left, at least partly because of the prince thing, but maybe from taking her away as well. Anyone else remember it differently?

[Somber]

ACK!  Did I seriously fuck that up!  Crap crap crap!

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